Reasonable Phone Contact

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mykidsdad

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In my parenting plan, i have a clause where i am allowed "reasonable" telephone contact with my children when i do not have them with me.

My ex has decided that "reasonable" contact has to be between 8-9 in the evenings and only for 20 minutes.

I dont see where this is reasonable at all. I have activities and things im doing and i am not always available between 8-9. And i will call at a time that i am available. I understand if they have activities and im not trying to interrupt my ex plans with them, but i dont see any reason how limiting the contact to those specific times is in any way reasonable.

She has told me that if i contact them outside of those times, she will take their phones away.

Can she do this? It doesnt see to me to be reasonable at all...
 
I am asking for a very specific reason.

What times do YOU consider reasonable? At what times would you be most likely to be making the contact left to yourself?
 
Sure... Normally I do contact them between 8 and 9...so in general, im not opposed to the time frame... However, I have a bowling league on tuesdays that i many times dont get done until 8:45 or so, and it starts at 7.

I am also in a tennis league and when we schedule matches it is usually in the evenings and many times are in the 7-9 range. This is normally 1 night a week as well.

During those times, i jsut want to call at maybe 7 or possibly after school on occasion depending on whats going on. (or 6ish if its a 7 match, no guarantee it will be over by 9)

I dont like to call after 9 because they are settling down for bed, but dont have to turn everything off until 10.

Does that help?
 
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Your kids activities are more important than your own. Their mother has apparently decided that calling earlier or later is disruptive to them and left a full hour for phone contact.
You need to decide whether contact with your kids is more important than bowling and tennis.
If you really think the limitation is unreasonable you will have to go back to court and address it there.
Yes, she can certainly take away their phones, but she would still have to keep them available for contact via the house phone or her own cell. There is no requirement that kids have personal cell phones.
 
I understand that their activities take precedence... However, most times they are at home in the evenings just playing in their rooms on their phones and/or ipads.

So a one hour timeframe is reasonable? with no flexibility even i they are not doing anything?
 
Part of your problem is word "reasonable". It means everyone uses their version of reasonable. You have your view other parent has theirs. The court wants you two adult parents to work this out in child/rens best interest not yours! You and other parent need to work this out. If you take this to court your likely to annoy Judge not only that in essence your saying your bowling is more important than your kids. I understand that's not true but outward appearance would suggest that
 
My father traveled for work during my childhood (like every week out-of-town). We didn't have iThings/computers/Intraweb/cell phones and collect phone calls were expensive. We didn't talk to Dad every night and all of my sibs and I turned out just fine. :party:
 
OP, here's some ideas I've seen people use with children age 5 to 8 years old. Children mature differently and you and mom know your kids' maturity level. If the kids are 10-12, or older, it's safe to say they already have the skills to make technology (21st or 20th century) useful.

Children are given post cards. Dad or mom use post cards, too. When talking is difficult to arrange, they write a few simple "what I did today", "what's cooking tomorrow", I miss you, I love you, how are you, I'm doing fine, etc...

With the advent of social media, private postings are used to communicate.

Of course texting is always easy, and pictures add to its flavor; as is email communications.

This keeps the children connected with the absent party, and eliminates worries over interfering with work, school, after school activities, etc...

Try to think outside the box dad, and create strategies that cause harmony, not discord. You seem like a man wanting to become a better dad, so put your thinking cap on and figure out what can make everyone happier.
 
Army Judge, I totally get that, but my ex is angry and her goal, stated in an email and text is to give me as little access to the kids as possible.

We originally had the contact as before 9 only, and this worked great, no issues. She just decided arbitrarily to say 8-9 and i even said a few minutes ago that i would agree to that if she woudl provide a little flexibility on occasion if i let her know ahead of time. She flat refused, and wont even discuss. Its all about what she wants, she is not willing to discuss or work things out with me at all.

Jsut a few minutes ago, she said if i dont return the boys clothes monday mornings she would not provide clothes any longer. I drop the boys off at school Monday mornings and then go to work. i have to drop 3 kids at different schools and make 2 different trips to the schools, so i am already very late getting to work on those Mondays. i told her i would bring the clothes to her on the way home in the evenings, but she said the boys wanted their ipads and apparently would be irreparably harmed if they don't have them for an hour and a half... im supposed to be into work at 7:30 and im already getting in around 10...i would be at least 10:30 if i had to go to her house in the mornings.

The way i see this, is thats a want vs a need... I wash all the clothes before i return them, so it isnt like she needs to wash them when returned.

Also, our decree says that the person gettign custody has to get the kids from the other, does that count for clothes as well? i've typically picked the boys up and dropped them off both...

I'm realyl not tryitng to be unreasonable, but she is frustrating me by continually changing things that have been working and now she is just trying to make things difficult, and im trying to figure out what she can and cant do... my kids are first, but i want to know what my rights are too...
 
Just some food for thought:

I have heard, on more than one occasion, of judges ruling that reasonable contact is satisfied if the children are made available three or four times a week and that every day phone calls are unreasonable.

Just echoes that the word "reasonable" is subjective and is likely different in meaning based on who you ask.
 
mykidsdad said:
Army Judge, I totally get that, but my ex is angry and her goal, stated in an email and text is to give me as little access to the kids as possible.

We originally had the contact as before 9 only, and this worked great, no issues. She just decided arbitrarily to say 8-9 and i even said a few minutes ago that i would agree to that if she woudl provide a little flexibility on occasion if i let her know ahead of time. She flat refused, and wont even discuss. Its all about what she wants, she is not willing to discuss or work things out with me at all.

Jsut a few minutes ago, she said if i dont return the boys clothes monday mornings she would not provide clothes any longer. I drop the boys off at school Monday mornings and then go to work. i have to drop 3 kids at different schools and make 2 different trips to the schools, so i am already very late getting to work on those Mondays. i told her i would bring the clothes to her on the way home in the evenings, but she said the boys wanted their ipads and apparently would be irreparably harmed if they don't have them for an hour and a half... im supposed to be into work at 7:30 and im already getting in around 10...i would be at least 10:30 if i had to go to her house in the mornings.

The way i see this, is thats a want vs a need... I wash all the clothes before i return them, so it isnt like she needs to wash them when returned.

Also, our decree says that the person gettign custody has to get the kids from the other, does that count for clothes as well? i've typically picked the boys up and dropped them off both...

I'm realyl not tryitng to be unreasonable, but she is frustrating me by continually changing things that have been working and now she is just trying to make things difficult, and im trying to figure out what she can and cant do... my kids are first, but i want to know what my rights are too...
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Okay, you want a legal interpretation, I'll give you one.
This isn't about rights, MKD.
Your divorce decree and/or custody order drives the answers you seek.
One or both also provide remedies or solutions.
However, don't get your hopes up.
Judges that preside over these types of matters prefer for both parties to work out their differences.
Think about it like this, MKD.
It's better to be part of a solution than have a judge shove one down your throats.

So, if you and your former spouse can't agree, your remedy must be pursued in court.
The court doesn't want to see you, unless its a very important matter.
You and her believe everything concerned with this is important.
See the problem? It's the reason many people leave out saying, he or she didn't do anything, AGAIN. (When discussing what happened during the latest family out hearing.)

Bottom line, it's your case, and you do have a right to seek legal redress.
The judge doesn't want to decide who washes clothing, what dud Bobby do with the bike I gave him, who picks up Junior, and punish someone for returning Little Polly 3 minutes late.

However, if that's the way you won't to play it, off to court you must go, MKD.
Get used to it, because it drags on and in and until the previous child becomes an adult.

Again, as Shrinkmaster wisely suggested, it's about the kids, always about what's best for the kids. Yes, that means you don't bowl, play tennis, or other pursuits if its your time with Little Lenny.

If you were working 1st shift, but now you're required to work 2nd shift, that's when consideration is given to your requirement. Why? That allows you to pay support and put food on your table, whereas bird watching doesn't.

The decision is yours, sir, and I wish you the wisdom necessary to chose wisely.
 
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Ok lets look at other side for just a moment. The kids need their clothes why are you not returning them with the children? The children want and probably often use their Ipads why should they not have them and why did they not go back with them? You two need to "coparent" the children and if required you or both of you may need court involvement in order to do this. the courts do not like this so make that a last resort
 
Thanks everyone for the replies! I really appreciate it...

I absolutely do NOT want to go to court, the only ones who win are the lawyers... i'm just frustrated trying to reason with the unreasonable.

As for the clothes gong back with them, i take the boys to school, i don't return them to their mother. There are too many clothes for them to go to school.

It is about the kids, and i do like to talk to them daily, at least a little bit and i will do everything in my power to make that happen. i love my boys more than anything. im also trying to get my life back on track, like many i get caught up in being dad and husband and stopped being me. I lost my own interests and jsut trying to get my life back on track and i dont want to sit at home and not do anything just witting to talk to them in the evenings.

as for the clothes, a friend an i were jsut talking and i think im jsut gong to buy my own and not have to deal with her...easier and less stress.
 
If you are calling daily, I can totally understand insisting those calls are at a set time frame each day rather than each day being different. Bowling is one of those activities that does not require you to be actively engaged the entire time. While it is Jane's turn to bowl, step out and call the kids. Or call after it is over. If you are the NCP, arguing that you have to once in a while adjust your social schedule to call our kids is going to pale in comparison to the parent who is juggling childcare, baths, homework, extracurriculars, dinner, and all the associated chores with each. Asking that parent to keep track of which day it is and when everything else needs to be shifted so you can go play tennis without having to pay attention to the clock or be inconvenienced, it not going to go over well.

Neither is your argument about withholding the kids' belongings until after work. Drop their stuff off at the home before you take them to school if you must. Complaining that once a week it is burdensome to get 3 kids off to school is going to ring very hollow when the other parent must do it the other 4 days a week.
 
I hope you & your ex can work something out satisfactory to you both. If you go to court, it doesn't always end up well for one or both parties.
 
Unfortunately, she is angry and being vindictive, and has stated via email and text that her intent is to in effect replace me as father to our children. She has clearly stated that he wants to let me have as little contact with them as possible... She hasn't violate the divorce decree, other than introducing them to a man who she admitted she WAS involved with prior, and I suspect she might still be, but I cant prove it. She continually has this man in the house with the children.

That is the reason for her limiting the contact. It isn't about her setting boundaries, but its about control and hurting me and pulling the kids away from me. The prior agreement was anytime before 9 when they need to be getting ready for be, and there were NEVER any issues with this arrangement. I still called only during the hours of 8-9 most times, and I would txt them occasionally to discuss things like a particular activity, or to talk about the parent and kids fantasy football league I started for all of us and a few other families. Anyone else in the league can text and have fun with this any time except i'm not allowed to do so.

I am not abusing this contact, I don't interrupt their activities or intrude on her time with them. More times than not they tell me they are sitting in their rooms playing on their electronics. I am trying to gently maintain that father son bond with them.

She flat said that because of the divorce, the limited contact with them is the consequences. I can deal with her talk, as long as her actions were not supporting the words.

We originally agreed I would have time over and above the time in the plan, but she continually threatens to take that away to get her way. I want as much time with my boys, so she has me by the short hairs unless I want to lose that extra time.

She has always had anger isues and acts first and thinks second, if she thinks at all...and she is very angry, so her goal is to make me suffer as much as possible. She is too smart to blatanly violate the decree, but I think she is violating the following statement with her continued words and actions.

She agreed to the statement in the parenting plan that says "We recognize that a close and continuing parent-child relationship and continuity in the child's life is in the child's best interest." But her statements and actions are acting contrary to this statement.

This was the reason for my original question...not because I want the kids to work around my life, but I want to maintain a strong and close relationship with my boys.
 
mykidsdad said:
Unfortunately, she is angry and being vindictive, and has stated via email and text that her intent is to in effect replace me as father to our children. She has clearly stated that he wants to let me have as little contact with them as possible... She hasn't violate the divorce decree, other than introducing them to a man who she admitted she WAS involved with prior, and I suspect she might still be, but I cant prove it. She continually has this man in the house with the children.

That is the reason for her limiting the contact. It isn't about her setting boundaries, but its about control and hurting me and pulling the kids away from me. The prior agreement was anytime before 9 when they need to be getting ready for be, and there were NEVER any issues with this arrangement. I still called only during the hours of 8-9 most times, and I would txt them occasionally to discuss things like a particular activity, or to talk about the parent and kids fantasy football league I started for all of us and a few other families. Anyone else in the league can text and have fun with this any time except i'm not allowed to do so.

I am not abusing this contact, I don't interrupt their activities or intrude on her time with them. More times than not they tell me they are sitting in their rooms playing on their electronics. I am trying to gently maintain that father son bond with them.

She flat said that because of the divorce, the limited contact with them is the consequences. I can deal with her talk, as long as her actions were not supporting the words.

We originally agreed I would have time over and above the time in the plan, but she continually threatens to take that away to get her way. I want as much time with my boys, so she has me by the short hairs unless I want to lose that extra time.

She has always had anger isues and acts first and thinks second, if she thinks at all...and she is very angry, so her goal is to make me suffer as much as possible. She is too smart to blatanly violate the decree, but I think she is violating the following statement with her continued words and actions.

She agreed to the statement in the parenting plan that says "We recognize that a close and continuing parent-child relationship and continuity in the child's life is in the child's best interest." But her statements and actions are acting contrary to this statement.

This was the reason for my original question...not because I want the kids to work around my life, but I want to maintain a strong and close relationship with my boys.
Click to expand...

Sir, no one is questioning your parenting ability, your approach to parenting your children, so you need not explain.

If she committed adultery, or is keeping loose company with fast men in the privacy of her home, that only tends to matter in one state, South Carolina. There might be one or two more, but SC is the primary one where those actions can be used to impact custody decisions.

If you're unhappy with her behavior, retain an attorney and litigate these issues before a court in Georgia.

Even if a billion people agreed that you should have sole custody (NOT THAT YOU'RE SEEKING SOLE CUSTODY, JUST USING THAT AS AN EXAMPLE); it would mean nothing in the instant matter you pose, nor would any real judge take the slightest judicial notice of our collective agreement.

I wish you the best.
 
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Heres your problem some of what your saying is your anger. You need to focus on children not how much you hate your EX. This is what happens when couples split each wants to get even with other and uses whatever tools available often times that's the children. If other parent is violating any portion of existing court order then take other parent back to court. That is where you will find your solutions as stated earlier in this thread. Your problem will be is court wants you two to co parent without court orders if court must make orders this will not fair well for either party again as stated earlier. You need to learn to co parent s does other parent. Its time you and other parent sat down and had an "adult" conversation oh how you two need to resolve your issues. You can find other parents on parenting forum (link below) who have had situations like yours and learned how to co parent without it being a battle or court involvement you might talk to them as well. This forum is associated with this site
http://www.parentnook.com/forum/
 
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