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Is this an international child support enforcement case

Discussion in 'Child Support' started by beltawell, Nov 21, 2019.

  1. beltawell

    beltawell Law Topic Starter New Member

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    Jurisdiction:
    Michigan
    I got divorce in China and a Chinese court entered the child support order. The child father has been living in USA many years. Last year my kid and I relocated to USA and we have lived here ever since. I'm studying here in a university.

    I applied for modification of support here and the court sent my request to the state the farther is living, but that state denied it due to lack of jurisdiction. The court said since China is not one of the Hague child support convention countries and foreign reciprocating countries, they can't help me anymore. They suggest me ask help from an attorney.

    As I know Hague Convention involves a foreign country of residence of either parent or child. But my kid, the father and I are all residents of USA. So I guess this is not an international child support enforcement case. Could you help me? Thank you so much.
     
  2. Zigner

    Zigner Well-Known Member

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    As you were told - you need an attorney.
     
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  3. justblue

    justblue Well-Known Member

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    I will tag some of the attorney's that volunteer here :

    @army judge @Tax Counsel @Michael Wechsler
     
  4. leslie82

    leslie82 Well-Known Member

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    Yeah you need a lawyer who specializes in this.
     
  5. zddoodah

    zddoodah Well-Known Member

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    What difference does it make what label you put on it?

    Since both parents and the child live in the U.S., the Hague Convention mentioned has no relevance to anything, but the suggestion that you seek assistance from an attorney is an excellent one.

    We are all anonymous strangers on the internet. Some of the regulars here are attorneys; some are not. We are spread all over the U.S. One of you is apparently in Michigan, but you didn't identify the other state involved.

    So...with all that in mind, what sort of "help" do you suppose we can provide (beyond answering questions, but you didn't ask any questions)?
     
  6. Tax Counsel

    Tax Counsel Well-Known Member

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    You asked the U.S. state court to modify a Chinese child support order. The problem is that the Chinese court order isn't recognized in the U.S. because China elected not to join the Hague convention. You can still get child support, but you have to start a fresh child support proceeding in the U.S., and very likely that must be done in the state where the father lives to get personal jurisdiction over the father. Seeing a family law attorney in your area for some initial advice on this would be a good place to start.
     
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  7. army judge

    army judge Super Moderator

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    If it is possible for you to obtain a child support order, it starts after you file a petition in Marquette County, MI.

    How old is the child?

    Is the child a citizen of China?


    These sites offer you child support information for the area where you are currently residing:

    Marquette County - MARQUETTE COUNTY FRIEND OF THE COURT

    Marquette County - CHILD SUPPORT
     
  8. beltawell

    beltawell Law Topic Starter New Member

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    I just wonder since my child and I have both lived in Michigan for nearly one year, and we're the residents here, why should I have to file a fresh child support proceeding in the father's state, not Michigan. Thanks a lot!
     
  9. zddoodah

    zddoodah Well-Known Member

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    For the reason that "Tax Counsel" explained: "to get personal jurisdiction over the father." By way of explanation, personal jurisdiction refers to a court's authority over a particular person. In the United States, family law matters are handled at the state level, and a court in the State of Michigan does not generally have jurisdiction to enter an order or judgment concerning a person who does not reside in Michigan. Not that "Tax Counsel" said "very likely," and I said "generally." I agree that consulting with a lawyer in your area would be the appropriate place to start.
     
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  10. beltawell

    beltawell Law Topic Starter New Member

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    I see. The other state court can figure out how much of child support for the state of Michigan, right? I appreciate your prompt help!
     
  11. beltawell

    beltawell Law Topic Starter New Member

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    The child is 3, and is US citizen. So can I file a fresh child support proceeding here? Thanks a lot!!
     
  12. beltawell

    beltawell Law Topic Starter New Member

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    To get an idea how to start this case, and which state court should have the jurisdiction. Thanks a lot.
     
  13. army judge

    army judge Super Moderator

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    Because as far as any US state is concerned, that ChiComm child support order is meaningless.

    Thus, you must start a new case in the US.

    Will you be successful, maybe, maybe not.

    If you live in State XXX, and the alleged father lives in State JJJ, State XXX has no jurisdiction over a citizen of another state.

    Your initial issue will be serving the father.

    That is why you need to speak with a lawyer.

    It might be more costly to pursue this, even if the man is served and genetic testing proves he's the father, if he has ZERO or LITTLE money.

    There are many legal barriers facing you.

    First and foremost, had the man been paying the ChiComm order?

    Was the man current on the ChiComm payments?

    What amount (in US dollars) was the man ordered to pay monthly based upon the ChiComm order?

    I suspect he wasn't paying, and getting him to pay is going to cost you far more than you could ever gain.

    You can try.

    The effort is yours to expend.
     
  14. zddoodah

    zddoodah Well-Known Member

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    The court in the father's still-unidentified state of residence will calculate child support based on its own laws and guidelines, not those of Michigan.
     
  15. Zigner

    Zigner Well-Known Member

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    I suspect it would be easier to simply file for support through MiChildSupport at MDHHS - Child Support
     
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  16. beltawell

    beltawell Law Topic Starter New Member

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    "army judge", thank you so much for those detailed questions. He owns 2 houses (all mortgage has been paid off). He claimed he has no job (but I know he's working for a company). Even no job, with 2 properties, I assume he should have money to pay child support. Is my assumption here correct from legal point of view?

    I'm sorry what is ChiComm? He has been paying child support, but the amount is just pretty little (according to Chinese order). The payments now are current, but he didn't pay for some period in the past. Please enlighten me more based on those details. Much appreciated!
     
  17. Zigner

    Zigner Well-Known Member

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    Child support is based on income. One can own two homes and have no (or very little) income.
    Go to the link I gave for information on how to begin the process. The state will (should) help.

    EDIT: Are you on public assistance of any kind?
     
  18. Red Kayak

    Red Kayak Active Member

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    However, if he appears to be voluntarily unemployed (or even underemployed, if voluntary), child support can be based on what he could be making, were he employed, based on his training/work experience.
     
  19. Zigner

    Zigner Well-Known Member

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    That is true. My main intention was to point out that ownership of property, in and of itself, doesn't affect child support.
     
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  20. army judge

    army judge Super Moderator

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    ChiComm = Communist China, the nation from whence you came before you arrived in the USA.
     

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