Widow disposing of heirs’ bequests

[Settling]

Jurisdiction

Georgia

My father recently passed, and his wife has dementia. His estate had no monetary value but his personal property has tremendous sentimental value. He specified one big-ticket item for her (as well as insurance), and he specified that the rest of his tangible personal property, wherever located, now belongs to his daughters.
Yesterday his wife told us that she is donating all of his clothing to Goodwill for a "big tax break." I was shocked and protested as politely as possible but was shut down. She said that she bought him the clothes and she can do as she wants with them. I offered to buy them rather than have her donate them but she wouldn't budge.
I think that if a sheriff accompanied us, we could get what is ours. HOWEVER, that would mean traumatizing an impaired, elderly woman whom my father loved. That's not an option we would consider. Is there any legal step we can take (or just sound advice to consider) that could preserve both our late father's property and a family relationship? She has already thrown some precious items away that she didn't recognize.
It would be easy to collect if her family succeeds in having her put into a memory-care facility, but we are trying to help her avoid that by hiring in-home caregivers. She is not safe on her own but she is not so far gone as to be forced out of the home she loves. I don't know how to gain access to our father's articles, though.
(NOTE: The will has not yet been probated. It is locked in her bank safety box; she lost the key; and she won't pay $150 for the bank to drill into it. How does that affect our position? What must be done to make her do this?)
Thank you for any advice.

 

[Zigner]

If there is no will, then his estate will pass according to the laws of intestate succession in your state. In a nutshell, the widow gets 1/3 and the kids get to split the other 2/3.

 

[Settling]

Zigner, thank you for responding. I'm confused, though. Your answer does not seem to pertain to my question. There is a will; we may need legal coercion to access it, although I hope not. The dementia causes her to be unpredictable. So far, she doesn't want to pay the $150 to drill the deposit box. But that isn't the crux of my question.
The pressing matter is how to protect my father's personal property from being thrown away or donated while in the house with his widow, who has dementia and doesn't understand our situation. We don't know what to do.

 

[army judge]

The pressing matter is how to protect my father's personal property from being thrown away or donated while in the house with his widow, who has dementia and doesn't understand our situation. We don't know what to do.

If this really sticks in your gizzard, you might wish to discuss the matter with a couple of local attorneys.

The initial consultation is often provided at no cost to the potential client and without further obligation.

 

[Settling]

Thank you, Army Judge. Maybe so — maybe there's some sort of protective order that a lawyer can issue for us. Of course, not even that would help if she doesn't recognize what is his. I don't know. It might be that I posted this on the wrong kind of site; it might not be legal advice I need but maybe a "relationship advice" forum. I'm sure there must be a legal way to access the items, but likely not a kind way. It's breaking my heart to lose sentimental items, but I don't want to make a hard situation harder for her.
My dad died from an accident, not a long illness, so this is still a painful shock for all of us. I don't want to act when maybe none of us is thinking clearly. I just wish I knew the right thing to do, both legally and ethically.

 

[army judge]

I just wish I knew the right thing to do, both legally and ethically.

If I thought any harsh act would damage the elderly woman, I'd forget about the property, and allow the infirm person to live out their remaining years in peace.

I have lost my beloved mother and father, a sister, my first wife, some incredible friends, among other loved ones.

No matter what may have been stolen, pilfered, or purloined from their belongings; I was left with the time I spent with each of them.

My best friend was killed in Nam.

He left a letter to me with his parents in case he didn't make it back.

His brother called me to inform me of his death, funeral arrangements, and asked where to send the letter.

Unfortunately i was still deployed in Nam, and Uncle Sammy doesn't allow his personnel to return from a combat zone to attend the funeral of friends.

Bottom line, I got the letter a few weeks later, and retain it to this day among my most prized possessions.

Your dilemma is unique, and the law probably can't assist you in the manner you desire.

I applaud you for being concerned with the delicate state of the woman's health, and sooner or later you'll self affirm your wise choice.

i wish you all the best as you persevere this latest traumatic event in your life.

May God bless and comfort you and yours as you traverse this thorny path.

 

[adjusterjack]

I'm sure there must be a legal way to access the items, but likely not a kind way.

There is, and here it is.

You open probate under intestacy (a will not produced is as good as no will at all) and petition the probate court to appoint you representative of the estate. That puts the power of the court behind you which will allow you to obtain court orders compelling her to preserve his personal property.

At the same time, the fact that you and your siblings share his estate with her should convince her to produce the will if the will is more favorable to her than intestacy.

You can also go to court and seek conservatorship over her.

 

[Disabled Vet]

You could start by offering to pay the 150.00 to have the lock box opened. That would get you access to his will. Maybe some of your questions will be answered by reading it. You not going to be able to do much without a court order.

 

[Zigner]

One other thought - offer to pay the cost of drilling out the box. If you know the bank where the box is located, go there ahead of time and work out a deal to pay it while they simply tell the lady they will waive the fee.

 

[zddoodah]

He specified one big-ticket item for her (as well as insurance), and he specified that the rest of his tangible personal property, wherever located, now belongs to his daughters.

Did he do these things in a will?

Yesterday his wife told us that she is donating all of his clothing to Goodwill for a "big tax break." I was shocked and protested

Why? Putting aside the fact that donating an ordinary person's clothing to charity isn't going to result in a "big tax break," do you really want your father's clothes?

I think that if a sheriff accompanied us, we could get what is ours.

This is a civil/probate court matter. It is unlikely that law enforcement would get involved.

Is there any legal step we can take (or just sound advice to consider) that could preserve both our late father's property and a family relationship?

No one here will have the slightest idea what will or won't preserve or damage "a family relationship" that we know nothing about. From a legal perspective, the appropriate thing to do if you object to what your stepmother (I assume) is doing is to file with the court to probate your father's estate.

The will has not yet been probated. It is locked in her bank safety box; she lost the key; and she won't pay $150 for the bank to drill into it. How does that affect our position? What must be done to make her do this?

Why don't you pay the $150? Do you have a copy of the will? If not, what is the basis for the first sentence of your post (where you described what your father "specified" about his estate)?

Regardless, I suggest you consult with a local probate attorney about all this.

 

[Settling]

If I thought any harsh act would damage the elderly woman, I'd forget about the property, and allow the infirm person to live out their remaining years in peace.

I have lost my beloved mother and father, a sister, my first wife, some incredible friends, among other loved ones.

No matter what may have been stolen, pilfered, or purloined from their belongings; I was left with the time I spent with each of them.

My best friend was killed in Nam.

He left a letter to me with his parents in case he didn't make it back.

His brother called me to inform me of his death, funeral arrangements, and asked where to send the letter.

Unfortunately i was still deployed in Nam, and Uncle Sammy doesn't allow his personnel to return from a combat zone to attend the funeral of friends.

Bottom line, I got the letter a few weeks later, and retain it to this day among my most prized possessions.

Your dilemma is unique, and the law probably can't assist you in the manner you desire.

I applaud you for being concerned with the delicate state of the woman's health, and sooner or later you'll self affirm your wise choice.

i wish you all the best as you persevere this latest traumatic event in your life.

May God bless and comfort you and yours as you traverse this thorny path.

If I thought any harsh act would damage the elderly woman, I'd forget about the property, and allow the infirm person to live out their remaining years in peace.

I have lost my beloved mother and father, a sister, my first wife, some incredible friends, among other loved ones.

No matter what may have been stolen, pilfered, or purloined from their belongings; I was left with the time I spent with each of them.

My best friend was killed in Nam.

He left a letter to me with his parents in case he didn't make it back.

His brother called me to inform me of his death, funeral arrangements, and asked where to send the letter.

Unfortunately i was still deployed in Nam, and Uncle Sammy doesn't allow his personnel to return from a combat zone to attend the funeral of friends.

Bottom line, I got the letter a few weeks later, and retain it to this day among my most prized possessions.

Your dilemma is unique, and the law probably can't assist you in the manner you desire.

I applaud you for being concerned with the delicate state of the woman's health, and sooner or later you'll self affirm your wise choice.

i wish you all the best as you persevere this latest traumatic event in your life.

May God bless and comfort you and yours as you traverse this thorny path.

Army Judge, thank you for this post. It is a lovely reminder that time spent, not objects, are my father's true legacy.

That said, it was a knife in the heart when she threw away a handwritten, bound journal, and locks of his silver hair tied in silk ribbon by the funeral director. Things like that, similar to your friend's letter from Nam, that are priceless even though they have no monetary value. We would be fine with her keeping most of it until death or total, mental impairment, so long as it could somehow be protected. There just does not seem to be a way.

It is more important to preserve her peace of mind, I suppose. It would be wrong to cherish the items he loved but disregard the woman he loved.

AJ, thank you again for your kind words and sound philosophy.

 

[Settling]

You could start by offering to pay the 150.00 to have the lock box opened. That would get you access to his will. Maybe some of your questions will be answered by reading it. You not going to be able to do much without a court order.

Yes, we probably will have to pay the $150 ourselves.

We all have a copy of the the will, so there are no surprises.

 

[Zigner]

Whoa, that actually changes things. You may wish to contact a probate attorney in Georgia, because, under the right circumstances, there is a mechanism to allow you to file the copy of the will instead of the original.

 

[Settling]

Did he do these things in a will?

Zddoodah, yes, we all have copies of the will that is in the bank box. We will likely need to pay the $150 to have it drilled open for her.

Zddoodah wrote:

Why? Putting aside the fact that donating an ordinary person's clothing to charity isn't going to result in a "big tax break," do you really want your father's clothes?

Yes, we do, especially accessories, which can be kept or worn to remember him by. Maybe a jacket that still smells of his cologne. That sort of thing. If the four of us had a chance to go through and keep some as mementos, maybe we would feel ok about donating most of them, too. But the idea that they could be so casually discarded, like garbage, before we even see them, was a great shock. And if it starts with the clothes, where will it end? This feeling doesn't come from logic; it comes from grief.
The idea of a "big tax break" is the product of her dementia. In her previous state, she would have known better. She also would be sentimental to the point of never wanting to throw away his things. If not for the dementia, we would not be worried about any of it.

Zddoodah wrote:

This is a civil/probate court matter. It is unlikely that law enforcement would get involved.

You would know better than I would, but I'm reminded of a friend's experience. He had sort of a reverse situation to ours. One morning about 6 am, without warning, a sheriff arrived at his door with some sort of court order. The sheriff accompanied our friend's step-siblings as they pretty much tore the place apart in search of personal effects that his father left to his stepmother.
Based on that, I thought some similar order might be available to us — although what happened to our friend is something we would never, ever do. I hoped maybe there could be an order to protect the items, not necessarily to hand them over.

Zddoodah wrote:

No one here will have the slightest idea what will or won't preserve or damage "a family relationship" that we know nothing about.

You are right. It took some discussion here to realize that I was looking for something different from what I thought I was looking for.

Zddoodah wrote:

From a legal perspective, the appropriate thing to do if you object to what your stepmother (I assume) is doing is to file with the court to probate your father's estate.
Why don't you pay the $150? Do you have a copy of the will? If not, what is the basis for the first sentence of your post (where you described what your father "specified" about his estate)?
Regardless, I suggest you consult with a local probate attorney about all this.

Yes, we have a copy; yes, we will need to pay the $150. Sad timing about a probate lawyer: When we met with the lawyer who drew up the will, Dad's widow had not yet dreamed up the idea of a donation-based tax break. With dementia, every moment can bring a different scenario. ("Stepmother" seems an awkward term as we were long since grown 20 years ago when my father, a widower, remarried. We have long regarded her as a friend who is married to our father.)

Thank you for all the thought you put into this post. I appreciate being able to discuss this; it helps me to work out the situation in my head.

 

[zddoodah]

we all have copies of the will that is in the bank box. We will likely need to pay the $150 to have it drilled open for her.

I agree with "Zinger" that you probably can probate the estate with a copy of the will and don't need to go to extraordinary lengths to get the original.

You would know better than I would, but I'm reminded of a friend's experience. He had sort of a reverse situation to ours. One morning about 6 am, without warning, a sheriff arrived at his door with some sort of court order.

The last six words of this sentence are what distinguish your friend's experience from your current situation. If you get a court order, then yeah, you should be able to get law enforcement's aid in enforcing that order.

Good luck.

 

[Settling]

Whoa, that actually changes things. You may wish to contact a probate attorney in Georgia, because, under the right circumstances, there is a mechanism to allow you to file the copy of the will instead of the original.

Well, the deposit box was drilled this morning and the will is not there. My dad left meticulous instructions about what to do about everything in case of his passing, and he said this is the location of the original will. His wife might have moved it at some point but now that she has dementia, it will never be found.

Zigner, I am all ears if you have heard of such a mechanism. A couple weeks ago, we met with the lawyer who drew up the will and he said this will be an intestate situation if we can't find the original. However, he was two days from retiring and this meeting was gratis, so he seemed to have little interest in our situation.

 

[Zigner]

Well, the deposit box was drilled this morning and the will is not there. My dad left meticulous instructions about what to do about everything in case of his passing, and he said this is the location of the original will. His wife might have moved it at some point but now that she has dementia, it will never be found.

Zigner, I am all ears if you have heard of such a mechanism. A couple weeks ago, we met with the lawyer who drew up the will and he said this will be an intestate situation if we can't find the original. However, he was two days from retiring and this meeting was gratis, so he seemed to have little interest in our situation.

I would pay a different attorney. Attorneys (and most others) tend to have more interest in a situation when they are paid to have interest in a situation.

Additionally, what your dad's widow is doing may amount to a crime as well.

 

[PayrollHRGuy]

I've not found the exact law but from a quick search, it seems that the copy of the will plus an affidavit from at least one witness to the original signing of the will you can submit it for probate.

 

[Settling]

I've not found the exact law but from a quick search, it seems that the copy of the will plus an affidavit from at least one witness to the original signing of the will you can submit it for probate.

I am optimistic that you and Zigner are right. I found this:

Georgia Probate Law - What do I do if I only have a copy of a Will and can't find the original Will?

 

[PayrollHRGuy]

I found that one as well but it is an advertisement for a lawyer and my get your last post removed. You may be able to edit it and take out the link.