Vehicle Repossession Vehicle given as a gift. Rightfully mine?

[fishstick]

Help!
I was living with a boyfriend and he gave me a truck for Xmas three years ago, he's never had possession. He called because he wants the truck back now three years later. The original title was in both our names with the infamous OR which gave him the opportunity apparently to go to the DMV and put the title in his name. It has been on his insurance and he has used it on his tax returns. All seven of his other vehicles have broken down and he is wanting the truck back. Do I have to legally return the truck? Can I file a Civil suit to keep the truck? Value is 25K. He paid 43K cash off a credit card for it. Says that since he is still paying the credit card, its his truck.
I dont have much time to file. He did tell my kids and some other folks that it was a gift originally. Oh, I did say that if he wanted to give me 10K, i would go buy something else or we could trade the truck in and both have a vehicle. Thank you
R

 

[CdwJava]

Help!
I was living with a boyfriend and he gave me a truck for Xmas three years ago, he's never had possession. He called because he wants the truck back now three years later. The original title was in both our names with the infamous OR which gave him the opportunity apparently to go to the DMV and put the title in his name. It has been on his insurance and he has used it on his tax returns. All seven of his other vehicles have broken down and he is wanting the truck back. Do I have to legally return the truck? Can I file a Civil suit to keep the truck? Value is 25K. He paid 43K cash off a credit card for it. Says that since he is still paying the credit card, its his truck.
I dont have much time to file. He did tell my kids and some other folks that it was a gift originally. Oh, I did say that if he wanted to give me 10K, i would go buy something else or we could trade the truck in and both have a vehicle. Thank you
R

Is your name still on the title and/or the registration? If so, you can always change it to your name. If his is now the only name, you will have to seek possession through civil court. However, if he paid for it, has it on his insurance, and has somehow been allowed to deduct it on his tax returns, and has all the DMV paperwork in his name he would appear to have a strong argument for ownership. But, a court might decide that it was a gift ... maybe.

You might consider consulting an attorney to whom you can provide all the details.

 

[mightymoose]

You are not obligated to give the truck back unless a judge orders you to. However, he could possibly take it back without a judges order, and that would complicate things. Consider changing the door/ignition lock or keeping the vehicle in a secure place so that it doesn't disappear on you. No, if he takes it the police will not consider it stolen. They will tell you to resolve the dispute in court.

You, I assume, have paperwork that shows the title in both of your names, and kind likely provide evidence that you have had exclusive use of the vehicle for three years. Regardless of what the paperwork now shows, after he changed it, if you can make a compelling argument that the vehicle was a gift and was yours to keep then you just might be allowed to keep it. If the two of you have been apart for a significant amount of time and he is now suddenly coming after the vehicle since he is in a jam, then you might be able to use that to your advantage. Maybe....

 

[CdwJava]

It sounds as if he has already changed the vehicle to his name. If so, she has an uphill fight on her hand. And if she goes for the full dollar value, it may well be beyond the limits of small claims court and she'll have to go at it pro se or hire an attorney. It ain't gonna be pretty either way.

 

[fredrikklaw]

FISHSTICK:

Well, the short answer here would be a resounding NO; he cannot ask for it back, well, that is not entirely true. He can ask for the truck back all he wants but you are under no legal obligation to oblige him and the truck is yours for all intents and purposes and it has been yours for three years now. It [the truck] in fact became yours the second he gave it to you, which brings us nicely to the actual reason why he is up the creek without paddle and cannot have the truck back.

You see, in his attempt to garner sympathy from mutual friends he has managed to comprehensively shoot himself in the foot by corroborating your claim that the truck was in fact given to you as a GIFT and that is where his claim of ownership to it ends. Because once the three conditions covering Gifs and gift-giving are met and satisfied, then the law regards the title and ownership as having been passed on and/or transferred properly which sounds like to be the case here.

The conditions are that (1) a donor (your ex) has the requisite intent to voluntarily make a gift to a donee (you) and (2) the donee accepts the gift and (3) there is finally an actual and physical delivery of the gift from the donor to the donee. And he cannot make an argument for ownership using the method by which he purchased the gift either and his continued monthly credit card payments are wholly irrelevant.

Now, while he cannot ask you to give him back the truck, he can however take the truck from you when you are not looking since his name appears on the registration as well as the title and it would be quite a big and idiotic mistake for him to report the truck stolen in order to regain possession. Your have of course inadvertently contributed to your dilemma by not registering and not titling the car in your name alone and are unfortunately left with no option at this point but to file a suit in order to keep the truck.

But since there are no claims (per se) that have accrued and you have sustained no injuries of any kind and neither one of you has breached any contracts, the suit that you need to file would have to be one for Declaratory Judgment and Declaratory Relief only which is a quick and inexpensive way to bring the controversy to a close. In such a suit, you will be asking the judge to declare your respective rights to the property under the law and then give the (permanent) relief prayed for.

fredrikklaw

 

[fishstick]

You are the best!

Can you do the paperwork for me to file? I will compensate you of course. Please...oh I am in San Bernardino County. He is in Bakersfield but this all took place here in Ontario three years ago. Do I need witness statements as to the gift or do they appear in court. Is there any documentation I can file with the other papers that will allow me to keep the truck until the court rules? I don't know that I can register it in my name, can I? And I can get insurance on it today.
Is there anything else that will make this a slam dunk for me?

 

[army judge]

You are the best!

Can you do the paperwork for me to file? I will compensate you of course. Please...oh I am in San Bernardino County. He is in Bakersfield but this all took place here in Ontario three years ago. Do I need witness statements as to the gift or do they appear in court. Is there any documentation I can file with the other papers that will allow me to keep the truck until the court rules? I don't know that I can register it in my name, can I? And I can get insurance on it today.
Is there anything else that will make this a slam dunk for me?

If the truck is legally in his name, it will be very hard for you prove that he gifted you the truck.
The problem for you is that IF he gifted yoiu the truck, why was it titled in BOTH names?
Beyond that little detail, you'd have to show why a person that wasn't wealthy would GIVE you a truck worth tens of thousands of dollars.
Finally, no matter what is said, the truck is legally his, as his name is the ONLY name currently on the title.
I think it will be very difficult for you to prove that the truck wasa gift.
He will probably say it was given to you to use, NOT to keep.
Otherwise, why would he have kept his name on the title?

 

[fishstick]

It was titled with the OR not the and. When the truck was purchased, the contract was signed by both of us. I didn't have the credit score to obtain it myself. He was wealthy at the time three years ago. He has not once driven the truck or had physical possession of the vehicle. He put the title in his name when he lost his business six months ago because his tax lady said that he could deduct it if it was in his name. I have the original title and all the original documentation as well as all of the invoices for repairs, etc. I have not seen him for three years now but since his other 7 cars and trucks have broken down, he feels that he should have this one back. I have at least four people that he told the truck was a gift including two police officers as well as my two kids and friends. He was very proud of the gift at the time when he had the money and didn't care.

 

[army judge]

It was titled with the OR not the and. When the truck was purchased, the contract was signed by both of us. I didn't have the credit score to obtain it myself. He was wealthy at the time three years ago. He has not once driven the truck or had physical possession of the vehicle. He put the title in his name when he lost his business six months ago because his tax lady said that he could deduct it if it was in his name. I have the original title and all the original documentation as well as all of the invoices for repairs, etc. I have not seen him for three years now but since his other 7 cars and trucks have broken down, he feels that he should have this one back. I have at least four people that he told the truck was a gift including two police officers as well as my two kids and friends. He was very proud of the gift at the time when he had the money and didn't care.

Good luck!

If I were you, I'd give him back his truck.

Some people might roll the dice and see if he carries through on his demand to return the truck.

Either way, good luck!

 

[mightymoose]

It sounds as if he has already changed the vehicle to his name. If so, she has an uphill fight on her hand. And if she goes for the full dollar value, it may well be beyond the limits of small claims court and she'll have to go at it pro se or hire an attorney. It ain't gonna be pretty either way.

Having changed the title or not, SHE is still in possession of the truck. HE has an uphill fight to get it back from her without some sneaky midnight mission taking place.

 

[mightymoose]

She has had exclusive access and use of the truck for three years and he suddenly comes back to claim that it was not a gift? Fat chance. She has a strong argument here.
If it was not a gift then she would not have had the vehicle for the last three years.

 

[army judge]

She has had exclusive access and use of the truck for three years and he suddenly comes back to claim that it was not a gift? Fat chance. She has a strong argument here.
If it was not a gift then she would not have had the vehicle for the last three years.

Yes, that is one way to view this situation.
He might say, on the othere hand, that she took the truck and he's been looking for it these last three odd years.
If he says that, a judge may not see it as a having been gifted.
There are other terms to describe what this could have been.
Magic words, Moose, magic words; we all were taught certain magic words in kindergarten.
Some folks take magic words and weave believable stories.
Gift, or something other than a gift?
Only thye "shadow" knows for sure!

 

[CdwJava]

Having changed the title or not, SHE is still in possession of the truck. HE has an uphill fight to get it back from her without some sneaky midnight mission taking place.

If he goes to retrieve it - and does so - she's going to have to go to court to get an order to return it to her. And it doesn't have to be all that sneaky ... request an officer for a civil standby to retrieve his property, the officer runs the registration and finds everything in HIS name, unless the vehicle is on her private property he is probably leaving with the truck that will legally be his until a civil court says otherwise.

It all depends on how much he wants to put into it. if he is hoping for voluntary compliance and accepts her not complying, then that's it ... unless she ever tries to sell or dispose of it. More than likely he will seek to retrieve it somehow. After all, he went through all the trouble of changing the paperwork back into his name. I doubt he would do that just to increase his liability for grins and giggles.

 

[CdwJava]

She has had exclusive access and use of the truck for three years and he suddenly comes back to claim that it was not a gift? Fat chance. She has a strong argument here.
If it was not a gift then she would not have had the vehicle for the last three years.

First, she needs to make that argument before a civil court judge. Until or unless that happens, HE has the trump hand should he choose to play it and he will also have the po-po on his side.

If she wants to retain her rights, she needs to head to court ASAP. My guess is that he will act before she is capable of getting a judge to hear the matter, but I'm just guessing and basing that on past experiences with knuckleheads acting like this.

Plus, I also wonder what HIS side of the tale might be?

 

[bluemann33]

Couldnt she as someone mentioned above change the locks on the truck legally to keep him from coming in the night and taking it? I know he can come with the cops but if she changes the locks to keep him from taking it whenever he feels like it and maybe hids it, then would he have to go to court to get the truck back? If its in his name could'nt he file a police report saying he let her use it and now she wont return it? Sorry for the long question lol.

 

[CdwJava]

Couldnt she as someone mentioned above change the locks on the truck legally to keep him from coming in the night and taking it? I know he can come with the cops but if she changes the locks to keep him from taking it whenever he feels like it and maybe hids it, then would he have to go to court to get the truck back? If its in his name could'nt he file a police report saying he let her use it and now she wont return it? Sorry for the long question lol.

Yes, she could try to conceal it, and he could try to make an embezzlement case out of it. That would require some additional scrutiny by a DA and he may not want that if he did, indeed, give it as a gift at some point.

 

[mightymoose]

If I were an officer in this situation I would really give a poo if he showed that it was in his name. I'm not in the business of taking property from one person and giving it to another. If she refuses to give it to him then he can get a judge to issue the order. Or, if he is lucky enough to find it in a public place or otherwise accessible then sure... go for it. Chances are that she could show paperwork with both of their names on it, and it would be incredibly obvious that this is a matter that no officer would want to get tangled in. When it is in dispute, property stays right where it is until a judge says otherwise.

Yes, he could take it, and then she would be in the jam that he now is... that is why I suggested she garage it or otherwise protect it to restrict his access.

She still is under no obligation to comply with his request regardless of the paperwork, and either of them can seek assistance from the court to remedy the problem.

 

[mightymoose]

Couldnt she as someone mentioned above change the locks on the truck legally to keep him from coming in the night and taking it?

There is nothing legal/illegal to be concerned with here. It is just a measure to make it difficult for him to quickly slip away with the truck.

I know he can come with the cops but if she changes the locks to keep him from taking it whenever he feels like it and maybe hids it, then would he have to go to court to get the truck back?

If she refuses to give it to him and he can not otherwise obtain the truck, then yes, he would need a judge's order. With that he could collect the vehicle wherever it is.

If its in his name could'nt he file a police report saying he let her use it and now she wont return it?

Nope... the officer would politely explain (without laughing) that he has a civil dispute, not a stolen vehicle. He allowed her to use the vehicle. She did not steal it. The agreed length for the use of the vehicle is a civil dispute.

 

[CdwJava]

Couldnt she as someone mentioned above change the locks on the truck legally to keep him from coming in the night and taking it? I know he can come with the cops but if she changes the locks to keep him from taking it whenever he feels like it and maybe hids it, then would he have to go to court to get the truck back? If its in his name could'nt he file a police report saying he let her use it and now she wont return it? Sorry for the long question lol.

If it is on the public street, he can show up with a tow truck and could likely just tow it away.

Remember, he will have all the proof he needs to show the cops and the tow operator until she gets a court order compelling it to be turned over to her.