Alcohol & Drugs: DUI, DWI DWI / No Miranda Rights

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JoeyBloeySmoey

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I was pulled over after speeding, officer came up to my car, asked for papers, I gave my ID, insurance, and registration docs to him. He went back to his car, then returned to mine. Asked me if I had anything to drink, I said no. He then asked me to do a sobriety test, I declined. His reason for requesting the test was that I was speeding. Second officer showed up, said he needs me to step out of the car, and I said that I'm not getting out. He said it smells like alcohol, and I told him it's not probably cause, so I am not getting out. There was a bar directly across the street, and the officer admitted that "correct, smell is not probable cause, and the smell may be coming from the bar over there, but we don't know for sure". I said I'm not getting out of the car, and told them to speak with my attorney. They told me to call my attorney, but I had no phone on me.

I have the above statements from officers recorded on video camera, about how the bar across the street may be the source of the smell. I also have them on camera with no probable cause other than them stating I was "speeding, which justified the suspicion".

Eventually they wound up breaking into my car against my consent, pulled me out, arrested me WITHOUT reading me my Miranda Rights. They offered me no ability to get in touch with a lawyer, after I repeatedly let them know I had no phone on me. They refused to speak with my lawyer either. The sergeant would not identify himself when I asked for his badge number & name... I believe officers do indeed have to state who they are when asked. I have this recorded as well.

Once in the station I told the officers they were dishonorable piles of shit for violating my rights. They wrote me up on obstructing justice & harassment because they did not like the comments I stated to them about having no honor, although I did not threaten them. I simple told them they were cowards.

I am meeting with a lawyer.

My question is....

Being that they read me no Miranda Rights, and essentially denied me right to legal counsel, and entered my car without probable cause, other than "speeding", how far will this actually go, and/or how do these aspects effect how this will proceed?
 
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I was pulled over after speeding, officer came up to my car, asked for papers, I gave my ID, insurance, and registration docs to him. He went back to his car, then returned to mine. Asked me if I had anything to drink, I said no. He then asked me to do a sobriety test, I declined. His reason for requesting the test was that I was speeding. Second officer showed up, said he needs me to step out of the car, and I said that I'm not getting out. He said it smells like alcohol, and I told him it's not probably cause, so I am not getting out. There was a bar directly across the street, and the officer admitted that "correct, smell is not probable cause, and the smell may be coming from the bar over there, but we don't know for sure". I said I'm not getting out of the car, and told them to speak with my attorney. They told me to call my attorney, but I had no phone on me.

I have the above statements from officers recorded on video camera, about how the bar across the street may be the source of the smell. I also have them on camera with no probable cause other than them stating I was "speeding, which justified the suspicion".

Eventually they wound up breaking into my car against my consent, pulled me out, arrested me WITHOUT reading me my Miranda Rights. They offered me no ability to get in touch with a lawyer, after I repeatedly let them know I had no phone on me. They refused to speak with my lawyer either. The sergeant would not identify himself when I asked for his badge number & name... I believe officers do indeed have to state who they are when asked. I have this recorded as well.

Once in the station I told the officers they were dishonorable piles of shit for violating my rights. They wrote me up on obstructing justice & harassment because they did not like the comments I stated to them about having no honor, although I did not threaten them. I simple told them they were cowards.

I am meeting with a lawyer.

My question is....

Being that they read me no Miranda Rights, and essentially denied me right to legal counsel, and entered my car without probable cause, other than "speeding", how far will this actually go, and/or how do these aspects effect how this will proceed?


You should speak with that attorney you have on retainer.
There's no way a bunch of strangers, unfamiliar with all of the facts in your case, could offer you anything more than speculation.
I can say that nothing about a DUI investigation or arrest would require the reading of Miranda rights to you.
The charges will go as far as the DA or prosecutor wishes to take them.
You didn't do yourself any favors by refusing to exit yoru vehicle, that simply gave the officers a legal excuse to enter your vehicle and extract your recalcitrant carcass.
The name calling served no purpose either, except to illustrate at trial that drunks often become belligerent.

I suggest you work with your lawyer to minimize the damage this will cause.
Your actions yesterday added to the financial, emotional, physical pain you'll feel in the coming days, weeks, and months.

One last thing, that surreptitious recording you made, in NY such recordings require two party consent.
Make sure you let your lawyer know about the recording, too.
It won't help.

All I can say is, once you started digging, you really went deep, buddy.
 
Recordings in NY do not require two party consent. If you are in communication with someone from within NY it's one party. Across state lines is when the law switches up.

There have been lawsuits here in my city where civilians have won for recording police, and the police said "no". Took the camera, and it's flat out illegal... the civilians have won multiple lawsuits against police in my jurisdiction for just that.

They did not read me my Miranda rights while I was detained and questioned in the jail. I requested an attorney and they denied me that right, then kept trying to question me. I will speak to my attorney, but I believe that is a violation of my rights flat out.

Correct, the name calling served no actual purpose.
 
Recordings in NY do not require two party consent. If you are in communication with someone from within NY it's one party. Across state lines is when the law switches up.

There have been lawsuits here in my city where civilians have won for recording police, and the police said "no". Took the camera, and it's flat out illegal... the civilians have won multiple lawsuits against police in my jurisdiction for just that.

They did not read me my Miranda rights while I was detained and questioned in the jail. I requested an attorney and they denied me that right, then kept trying to question me. I will speak to my attorney, but I believe that is a violation of my rights flat out.

Correct, the name calling served no actual purpose.

Yes, NY is a one party consent state.
If you think the recording will help, talk to your lawyer about using it.

I won't engage in an argument.
You asked a question, I gave you an answer.
You're free to ignore, and if you're smart, you will seek the counsel of a NY licensed attorney.
You'll soon discover, as you recently did with the police, that the judge, the prosecutor don't care what you think.
It isn't about what you think, feel, or perceive; you broke their law.

You insulted their centurions, and they'll probably make you pay dearly.

Its never a good idea to argue with the Blue Knights.
You can't beat them on their turf.

I wish you well.
 
There is ample case law that permits an officer to direct you out of your car on a stop. Your failure to comply with that could be considered obstruction (or the equivalent law in NY).

If they interrogated you after you were arrested and did not properly advise you of Miranda, then any incriminating (non-booking) statements you made after that arrest cannot be used against you. I suspect, however, that they will use statements made at the scene against you, not anything said later. But, that info should be in the police report.

As for not providing you his name and badge number, that's not relevant to any criminal proceeding, so you can complain to the agency ...provided that is a violation of policy. Though he could have been flippant and replied, "They'll be on the booking paperwork," and that may well have sufficed.

Oh, and about 9 in 10 arrests will not need Miranda rights read to the arrestee. Miranda is generally only required when both custody (i.e. after an arrest) and an interrogation are present.

And, quite frankly, HOW does a bar have the stench of alcohol wafting across the street??! Sorry, but I have never known a bar to have that much broken booze on the ground, or that many drunk and stinky patrons for that to ever be a factor. I can walk outside of a bar and not smell the odor of alcohol! And the smell of wet alcohol is different than that which emanates from a person's body as it is being purged from their pores, or on their breath. The two odors are very different as well as distinctive.
 
The only time I've ever smelt alcohol wafting through the air was a (late night) drive through Lynchburg, TN, home of the Jack Daniel's distillery.
 
When I was a young lawyer just starting my private practice (was it five, maybe six years ago - LOL) I'd go to court and watch experienced lawyers try and plead their cases because I had very few at that time (LOL).

During one such session, I watched a noted defense lawyer acclaimed for her ability to defend "drunk drivers".

She was cross examining the arresting officer, a young state trooper about his direct testimony because he testified that he smelled "alcohol on the defendant's breath".

Now, I had always been taught that alcohol was a colorless liquid devoid of any odor.

In fact, humans don't drink "alcohol" per se, they drink distilled or fermented "spirits".

My ears perked up, and I was actually mesmerized by her cross examining skills, as she seemed to relax and beguile the trooper, leading him to his eventual legal evisceration.

You see, as her expert witness, a chemist and professor at nearby university later testified, what we smell as humans is actually acetic acid (we know it as acetone, and diabetics often release a similar odor when they exhale).

Anyway, she was amazing to observe by a recently retired JAG, and budding young, civilian lawyer.

The defendant, a wayward scion of a wealthy oil family got his not guilty verdict.

About three weeks later I learned he died in a one car crash and when his toxicology report came back, it was revealed he had a .29 blood alcohol level.

The brilliant female lawyer, well, she and I are now great friends, and she heads a law firm renowned for DUI defenses and family law.
 
That's why we train officers not to testify that they smell "alcohol" ... but, a good prosecutor will be able to correct any such issue of odor on re-direct.
 
That's why we train officers not to testify that they smell "alcohol" ... but, a good prosecutor will be able to correct any such issue of odor on re-direct.

True, and that was ahem, a few years ago.
Plus, Texas justice in our back country outposts is somewhat of an anomaly today.
It rarely happens today.
 
Things always ebb and flow over time. :)
 
You blew it. You did everything wrong. The police had cause to arrest you the moment you refused the sobriety test.
Your complaints about Miranda, entering your vehicle, and access to an attorney are non-issues. As you describe it, Miranda was not likely required, they had a right to enter your car and remove you after you refused the sobriety test, and your right to an attorney is not immediate upon your demand, it is for representation in court.
I suggest you meet with your attorney, cone clean abit everything you've done, and quickly change your tube about how to proceed. You are on a path to achieve the worst possible outcome.
Nothing you've provided here indicates any wrongdoing by the police but lots of wrongdoing by you!
 
As it will probably go in court; the racket. They had no reasonable grounds to request a FST of any sort, short of my speeding & their delusions of "alcohol" smells.

If they have no reasonable grounds to initiate a FST in any regard, how are they able to violate my 4th amendment and just arbitrarily open my vehicle? I am not understanding this, if this is what law is.

The biggest thing I have going against me is 4-5 officers who are liars. They slapped me in the face with a book at jail too, which depicts their character as lacking integrity & honor.
 
As it will probably go in court; the racket. They had no reasonable grounds to request a FST of any sort, short of my speeding & their delusions of "alcohol" smells.

If they have no reasonable grounds to initiate a FST in any regard, how are they able to violate my 4th amendment and just arbitrarily open my vehicle? I am not understanding this, if this is what law is.

The biggest thing I have going against me is 4-5 officers who are liars. They slapped me in the face with a book at jail too, which depicts their character as lacking integrity & honor.

Now you're getting it, my friend.
The word of ONE blue knight is very hard to overcome.
If you get six blue knights singing the same song in harmony, well, that's all but impossible even for the elite of our society.
This is precisely why you never argue with a blue knight in the street, as they rule supreme.
The place to argue about the actions of a blue knight is in a courtroom.
On the street, its always "yes, sir", "no, sir", "I want to remain silent, sir, or ma'am"; whatever you do, don't resist or obstruct.
 
Please explain why you refused to comply with the Officers? If you had done nothing wrong this would have been over quickly and without issue.

Example: Years ago (right after I separated from EX wife) my 3 kids and I lived in a Motel. Of course there were many undesirables living there as well. I went outside to use pay phone (right outside our room). A "Blue Knight" came to phone booth and began to question me. He asked me if I would empty my pockets. I comply with all his requests. He thanked me and moved on. I went back to my call.
 
The Blue Knight (TV show opening)

http://youtu.be/1PnnrLPBcWY


From Joseph Wambaugh's book, we meet Bumper Morgan, an old school LA beat cop, portrayed by Bill Holden.

Bumper says to the kid he arrested when the kid began spouting Supreme Court precedents and rulings, "You see, down here I'm forced to write my own decisions. You're being charged with contempt of cop."

My uncle who was a cop in Nawlins, called it "reviling the police".

https://law.resource.org/pub/us/case/reporter/US/415/415.US.130.72-6156.html

Three of my great-uncles, and two of my uncles were cops, old school, beat cops in DC, New York, New Orleans, and Philadelphia. Oh, the stories they would tell a young kid.



http://youtu.be/OYtOGJ6dT5c
 
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Update: DWI was dismissed and sealed in court. DMV refusal hearing resulted in remission of my driving privileges on the basis that I was denied legal counsel. The Judge smashed the cops and essentially threw them out of the hearing office on that basis. Funny how people in this forum like to talk like I am the only guy in the wrong...

The cops... they don't do their job right. Can't wait until this is all over and done with, cause I'm going to try and get their badges removed & potentially file suit on the county, etc... some of these fuckers are 23 - 25 years old... are you fucking serious?... what has this country come to... send these fucking children back to school before they are allowed to be officers of the LAW.
 
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Update: DWI was dismissed and sealed in court. DMV refusal hearing resulted in remission of my driving privileges on the basis that I was denied legal counsel. The Judge smashed the cops and essentially threw them out of the hearing office on that basis. Funny how people in this forum like to talk like I am the only guy in the wrong...

Fucking cops... they don't do their job right. Can't wait until this is all over and done with, cause I'm going to try and get their badges removed & potentially file suit on the country, etc... some of these fuckers are 23 - 25 years old... are you fucking serious?... what has this country come too... send these fucking children back to school before they are allowed to be officers of the LAW.


The refusal to blow or submit to a blood test did you in, my friend.

The good news, you beat the DUI/DWI. CONGRATS!!!

That can't be overturned.

The administrative trap was sprung upon your refusal.

They gotcha, pal.
 
The refusal to blow or submit to a blood test did you in, my friend.

The good news, you beat the DUI/DWI. CONGRATS!!!

That can't be overturned.

The administrative trap was sprung upon your refusal.

They gotcha, pal.

Well something I have to attempt to look into is the fact that I was never requested to take a breathalyzer - they can look through all their dashcams & barrack cams they want, because it was never asked of me to perform. The only thing the cops said during my stop was "we need you to step out of your car to make sure you can drive", to which I replied "no, I want to call a lawyer". They were asking me to step out, trying to FST me, but never asked specifically for me to do one, let alone a breathe test.

I am going to ask my attorney about a possible subpoena for the cams, because they perjured themselves at the DMV hearing, by telling the Judge they asked me to take a breathe test. Although I doubt anything will result in it, it would be nice to be able to get them on Perjury.

They took me to the hospital to which I was also never requested to do any sort of test.

I don't know how solid it holds for an officer to say "step out because we need to make sure you can drive", in regards to equating that to "will you take a breathe test?". In order for that request to be valid wouldn't the officer have to say "will you take a breathalyzer and/or breathe test?". Then again, nothing would surprise me with the way the system works (doesn't work)...

I bet the officer could... Officer: "Did you take your dog for a walk today?"... Officer speaking to Judge "Yes your honor, I specifically asked him to take a breathe test when I asked if he walked his dog, that's what I was inferring because I wasn't sure if he could walk his dog, he may of been too drunk to walk".
 
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