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Diagnosed Histrionic Narcissist withholding child - want to file for emergency relief

Discussion in 'Child Custody & Visitation' started by Pro Se Mother Justice, May 31, 2019.

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  1. Pro Se Mother Justice

    Pro Se Mother Justice Law Topic Starter New Member

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    Jurisdiction:
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    SUMMARIZED (2 YEAR) HISTORY:
    (scroll to see questions for attorneys)

    Son's father was ordered to have a domestic violence evaluation. Results: high on the Histrionic and Narcissistic scales.

    Son's father was able to procure "evidence" of me being an "unstable parent". His agenda? Revenge for not allowing him to move back in with me and our son after already abandoning our son, willfully, for over a year (son was only 2 1/2 years old at the time). Court ordered me to have non-professional supervised visitation, only 2 days per week, 2 hours per day.

    Submitted a supervisor oath signed by a good friend. Instantly rejected by son's father and his attorney. Reason? Because she is addicted to drugs, has a "group sex" tape (Tape? Do people still make VHS tapes?), and lives in a shack or outhouse. Of course all slanderous lies, since his goal is to use our son as a weapon to harm me. He literally does not care about our son's well-being. After she (friend) came to trial in support of me, he attempted to cost her her job, as retaliation.

    Submitted another supervisor oath from my former therapist who literally contracts with CPS to provide supervised visitations for people in CPS custody disputes (ours is a "private dispute", not CPS related). Rejected.

    Five (5) months later, after piecing my life together financially and making a new friend who he had no association with or ability to reject as a supervisor... Five months of my 3-4 year old son not being held by his loving, doting mother - his only parent equipped with Empathy - I was finally able to see my son. We started with the 2 hour visits twice per week, until I submitted a damning declaration of evidence disputing his claims against my good friend who he slandered and tried to cost her job. Suddenly, I was seeing my son as frequently as my new friend's time allowed.... 30+ hours per week became the status quo. Though, I never filed a motion to have the declaration reviewed in court, feeling powerless without an attorney at the time. But it seemed enough to scare my son's father into giving us whatever days and times we wanted with my son.

    After my son reporting abuse to me and my supervisor/friend and taking my son to the hospital, my friend withdrew as supervisor out of fear of retaliation on her and her family. CPS took no action, due to "lack of evidence". We remain close, as I nannied for her four (4) children, all under the age of 8, for many months before my current position that I've held for the past 6 months. She started advocating for me via text with my son's father to just have some alone time with my son, since it was clear that's all he desperately wanted. Just some alone time with mama with no competition from four (4) girls. That's when my son's father started lashing out, passively suggesting we go back to 2 days per week, 2 hours at a time.

    Maybe you've gathered already that my son's father isn't quite right. I don't need to try to convince anyone. I have an army of people behind me; from co-workers to new friends and all of their associates...

    After my friend withdrew as supervisor due to feeling unsafe, I have not seen my son for another four (4) months. I'm being advised by attorneys that I need to fulfill a $1500 mental health evaluation (out of my current budget) and 16 week parenting class before a judge will hear me. But do you know what I cannot hear? The lies. Because no respectable Judge or Commissioner is just going to ignore what's really going on. Not with the evidence I have...

    With much hesitation, I submitted another supervisor oath, submitted by my partner whom I've been with for the past 9 or so months. Someone I first met when we were teenagers and recently reconnected as adults (we're in our late 30's). I sent a copy to my son's father's attorney, along with 2 other e-mails. No response. I sent a copy directly to my son's father. His response was "I will have to do a background check." He had already done a background check last year when first learning of our relationship (My son's father is a felon and a "recovered" addict). I pressed him Monday for when I could expect a response regarding a day and time for me to see our son. He said "(name) is a conflict of interest." I said "Do you mean a conflict of YOUR interest?" No response. So I said, "Are you currently representing yourself?" No Response.

    It turns out he's been representing himself for... possibly months now. Apparently his attorney who practices criminal law finally dropped him, due to... Probably being professionally reprimanded. He was reprimanded by the judge who oversaw our trial last year, in a very cryptic way, but I was able to pick up on the tells. The same happened at the review hearing to deliver final orders... I had submitted my declaration with all evidence disputing his demoralizing claims against my good friend who he rejected as a supervisor, attaching his attorney's e-mails. But what I did not realize at the time was that the judge's hands were tied because it was not the appropriate procedure to submit that evidence at that time. I should have filed a motion, etc. Yet, she had reviewed what I had submitted and was visibly livid with my son's father and his attorney at the final orders hearing, even stating "and let your client know I am not pleased with him." (son's father was not present for hearing)

    Now that I know he does not have representation and that no one (attorney-wise) will touch him with a 10 foot pole, frankly, all of the money I had just set aside to hire an attorney would be better spent helping my son re-adjust to a normal life back with his mother. I've been pro-se for two (2) years now, and while I'm not an egotistical Narcissist like my son's father, I believe that there are other ways to utilize the system to make it work for you, without an attorney. My life is dedicated to my son, so the last response I want here, on this forum, is: "My best advice is; you need an attorney." Thanks, but no thanks. I know how to read. I have a legal advocate through the YWCA. I just want compassionate, solid answers to real, legal questions.
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    QUESTIONS:
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    I am going to file a motion for emergency relief. Clearly this is "Abusive Use of Conflict", him denying everyone who signs on as a supervisor and then terrorizing people in support of me. The evidence is all in texts I'm submitting and previously submitted, unreviewed declaration...

    - If a judge finds my evidence of abusive use of conflict satisfactory, what orders could be expected? What relief could be expected?

    - What type of relief is reasonable to ask for, given the circumstances?

    - How could I go about finding out whether or not my son's father actually was dumped by his attorney?

    - I have not fulfilled a $1500 mental health evaluation or a 16 week parenting class, due to costs. If I enroll in the 16 week parenting class literally now, while showing evidence of an agency I've been in contact with in regards to starting the mental health evaluation process, is this going to be substantial enough to grant me the emergency relief I'm asking for? What I've come to find out is that a "mental health evaluation" takes 2-3 months to complete. I'm not a criminal. I'm not unstable. I'm just a mother trying her damndest to protect her son. The only things I have "against me" are the false claims from my son's father, whom I have not been in a relationship with for at least three (3) years now.

    CONTEMPT OF COURT:

    - Is it appropriate in this emergency relief motion to address the ways that he is in contempt? He was ordered to either enroll our son in daycare or preschool, which he did not. Instead, he isolates our son with him. He takes our son to work with him. He is not educating our son. He is also not vaccinating our son. He is not following up on medical visits.

    - He has not followed up with the 6 follow-up sessions recommended by the person who gave him the domestic violence evaluation. This was ordered by the court.

    - No drug/alcohol assessment (contempt).

    - Has not taken our son for an evaluation (contempt).
    ---------------------------
    I need thoughts and guidance. I will not hire an attorney. I do not have $10,000-$20,000 laying around as a down-payment. I do not have bad credit, but I also do not have credit for this type of loan. I do not have three (3) weeks to wait to get into another free "legal clinic", just to hear another attorney tell me "my best advice is: Get an attorney."

    Thank you, sincerely, for taking the time to review my circumstances. I've been patient. I've been strong. Now, is the time, to take action. Please, person to person, I need your professional thoughts.

    - Pro Se Mother Justice
     
  2. flyingron

    flyingron Well-Known Member

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    You are rightfully emotionally involved here, but it means you are ill-suited to do this pro se. You need a person to take a dispassionate view of the facts and make informed actions based on what is there. That person is called an attorney.

    I'm not seeing any way that the court will consider an action in this mess as such requiring "emergency" action. Also, abusive use of conflict means conflict aimed at the child, not you. The fact that the DPS has not found abuse in their estimation doesn't bode well for you.

    Your ex's relationship with his attorney is irrelevant. You'll find out next time you're in court if he is no longer represented. If he isn't, the "why" is not something you're entitled to demand or use in your case.

    You appear to be as much in contempt of the court as your ex is.
     
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  3. Pro Se Mother Justice

    Pro Se Mother Justice Law Topic Starter New Member

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    This type of response is exactly what I'm talking about. A flamboyant disregard for the power of truth. Also, a complete disregard for the level of undeniable strength and stability it
    requires to stay in one piece regarding issues pertaining to child abuse.

    "flyingron", i appreciate your bravery to speak on the matter, but it sounds like you're quick to dismiss the power of evidence and truth; things judges and commissioners are not idiots about. Especially when a child's safety and well-being are at stake...

    Actually, when a child is wrongfully being alienated from a loving, stable, capable parent, that is considered "abusive use of conflict", because it's maliciously attempting to destroy a healthy bond that the child has. Courts are recognizing more and more the effects of psychological abuse, and using lies and manipulative tactives to prevent a child from seeing a parent they're bonded to is 110% abusive and harmful to the child; especially where the child's development of a sense of security is concerned.
     
  4. Pro Se Mother Justice

    Pro Se Mother Justice Law Topic Starter New Member

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    I'm sorry, but "rightfully emotionally involved"? Is that really your best sales pitch, or "try at 'work empathy' ", to convince the lay-person they "need an attorney" lol. Excuse my laughter, but it's a seriously flawed sales pitch.
     
  5. justblue

    justblue Well-Known Member

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    I suggest you perhaps borrow the money and hire an attorney as you find the advice offered by Ron to be so amusing.
     
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  6. Zigner

    Zigner Well-Known Member

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    Pro Se Mother Justice: I'm going to be brutally honest here with my opinion. First, I'm going to tell you what an opinion is (in this context)...an opinion is my belief based upon what you have written, which is as much as you have deigned to tell us.

    Now, my brutally honest opinion is that you are an angry, bitter person who borders on paranoia. You have absolutely no evidence of anything except that you are not getting your way. The court has found it proper that your son be with his father and have very limited visitation with you. Your agreed-upon custody supervisor has quit and now you want your brand-new "partner" to supervise your visits which really goes against the intent of a supervisor. You are going to lash out at anyone who does not come out squarely in support of you, so there really is no reason to advise you. I suggest that you get (in this order) a therapist and an attorney. Good luck to you.
     
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  7. flyingron

    flyingron Well-Known Member

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    These "judges and commisioners" are not idiots, but you ascribe hostile intentions to them. While you coach some of your words as compliments, the fact is you are an insulting person who doesn't want to hear anything that you haven't already decided is the right answer. I'm sorry, we can't help you. My answer stands. You don't have either the legal knowledge or the dispassionate view of the case at hand to do this pro se.
     
  8. Pro Se Mother Justice

    Pro Se Mother Justice Law Topic Starter New Member

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    The problem I'm having with what you're saying is that it's clear you did not read my post. Or you read it from a biased, assumptive position.

    A parent using a child as a weapon IS abusive use of conflict. Isolating a child and not giving them an education IS harmful. Not following through on court orders for domestic violence sessions, on top of not having our child evaluated... A judge/commissioner is going to reprimand him for contempt. I want to know what "reprimanding" looks like in this case.

    I have respect for the justice system but I've lost respect for all of the "you Can't" answers attorneys have. Yes i can.
     
  9. Pro Se Mother Justice

    Pro Se Mother Justice Law Topic Starter New Member

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    Zigner,

    I understand what you're saying. You're clearly saying "i did not read your post. But i would like to insult you and pass it off as 'legal advice'." Thanks, but no thanks.
     
  10. Zigner

    Zigner Well-Known Member

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    You are showing my post to be more and more accurate with every reply. Please seek legal/professional help.
     
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  11. cynthiag

    cynthiag Active Member

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    Unfortunately, I think we've all seen this sort of thing before. In my experience, it's pretty much always when the mother has lost custody or even voluntarily made a custody agreement that she then regretted. Suddenly, the whole world (ex, judges, entire court system) is conspiring against her because they will not give in to her demands that things be done the way that she thinks they ought to be.

    They pretty much invariably portray the child's father as a narcissist, accuse him of being abusive, and claim that the only reason the father is fighting to keep custody of their child is as revenge against the mother for dumping him, not taking him back, cheating on him, or whatever the case may be. They always portray themselves as the victim.

    And yes, I did read that whole VERY LONG post from beginning to end. It did nothing but affirm my conclusions.
     
  12. army judge

    army judge Super Moderator

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    I agree, I have seen exactly what you asserted.

    I have also seen the role played equally as well by a male.
     
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  13. Pro Se Mother Justice

    Pro Se Mother Justice Law Topic Starter New Member

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    I'm still hoping my questions will be answered...

    A few things. First, It's not me who diagnosed my son's father. It was a mental health professional who gave him a domestic violence assessment. He ranked high on the histrionic and narcissistic scales. This is not "my opinion" of him. If someone were to ask me my opinion, I'd say "antisocial personality disorder" without blinking. I get that "my ex is a narcissist" is "trending" all over the world right now, but in our circumstances, my son's father literally did not develop fully due to an abusive upbringing.

    My son's father has 2 other children he has not seen in about 10 years. I was given their psychiatrist's letter to the court stating that he had caused one of the children OCD and both PTSD.

    I would like some advice on how to file for emergency relief to see my son since he is being withheld for zero reason. Advice from someone who has not deamonized my circumstances who isn't going to "victim shame" me or say these circumstances are all in my head, etc. Again, I'm not the one diagnosing him with these very serious cluster B personality disorders that affect a person's ability to empathize and who can become very dangerous when they feel crossed.
     
  14. cbg

    cbg Super Moderator

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    When you contacted a family law attorney in Washington for a free consultation, what did that attorney say?
     
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  15. Pro Se Mother Justice

    Pro Se Mother Justice Law Topic Starter New Member

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    army judge and cbg... I appreciate your participation on this thread.

    I have been working with my legal advocate through a domestic violence organization every 3 or so weeks (per her limited availability) and we have been filling out contempt paperwork. She is a "legal advocate" and a hero in my book. I have not daemonized the legal system, judges, (all) attorneys, etc. I have a very realistic viewpoint of "the system(s)", how they do (and do not) operate, etc.

    My legal advocate believes that my best shot is to "play things safe", file contempt paperwork because clearly he is in contempt, while being in 100% compliance with court orders on my part so that essentially nothing can reflect negatively upon me. She makes a lot of brilliant points. The "but" is that, she is not a mother. She operates like a calculated machine and I so very much respect her and need her for exactly that. Easily a lot of my respect stems from the fact that I operate on a very similar level.

    I am not a "reactive" person. I studied under a Stanford Psychology grad to learn positive reinforcement dog training, operant conditioning, etc. It's clear that I've been mistaken for a "reactive mother who cannot handle the pressures of a court room on her own", but there's really only one thing that I cannot handle in this world - not seeing my son and being able to protect him from a man who does not have his best interests at heart. I will not back down.

    The other day I was on the phone with my son and he said to his father "dada, I think I want to live with you forever. Is that okay?" His father's response: "Well, son. We will not live together forever, because you're going to grow up really quick, have your own job and make lots of money, have your own house, and we won't live together anymore." Really? Really??

    It's probably extremely difficult to imagine that "someone like me" as I've (affectionately) been cast-typed on this forum, would have been celebrating, if only my son's father had said "Yes, you can always live here. I'm always going to be here for you. I love you", addressing the very serious, unnecessary insecurities that have developed in my son, due to "judicial abuse". Before you freak out, I do not say "judicial abuse" lightly, nor "just because I didn't 'get my way' ". I say it because, a criminal law attorney took on a family law matter, believed his deceptive client, and then dumped his ass (his client/my son's father), after being professionally reprimanded for supporting what came to be blatant lies. They creamed me in court when I was not standing very tall. But I've since learned.

    This is the stain of a Narcissist. The disability to recognize that it's less important to acknowledge what a child will "grow up to be to make a father proud", and more important to instill STABILITY and SECURITY in a child, while they're developing. My son is, excuse my French, FOUR FUCKING YEARS OLD. Does he really need to be thinking about when he'll be thrown out the door to survive on his own? Please, take this question to heart. If he could love my son rather than parade him around like a trophy, none of this would be up for discussion. If the blatant assumptions made here were true, I'd be some burnout in a ditch mumbling to myself. Not here, talking about my son's father's deficiency in recognizing the needs of a child, trying to find emergency relief for his blatant abuses of the court system to isolate our son.

    I could literally be an asshole and say "maybe attorneys have been trained to lack empathy, like the most successful Narcissists in the world", but that would be counter-productive. Oops. So let's stop the type-casting. It's easy to sling insults. What do I take as an insult? Someone type-casting me as having the inability to separate my emotions from a situation in order to "get the job done".

    I have zero issues with composing myself in a court room and coming across as an articulate individual who speaks truth from the heart. Unfortunately for my son's father (and my son), his ego gets in the way of everything he does. He thinks that he can bully his way into what he wants. He punishes those who do not fall in line. But no judge or commissioner is going to put up with his BS, now that he does not have an attorney to hide behind. That's why I am preparing to file contempt paperwork within the next couple of days, to hit him hard and fast before he's able to even ask for attorney advice on how to proceed.

    "A person's a person, no matter how small." If you're inclined to empower me with your knowledge and experience, I'm extremely open to receiving the information you'd like to share with me. Please come from a place of support. Be reminded that Domestic Violence and Narcissistic/Histrionic traits are EVERYONE'S problem. My kid could be sitting next to yours in class or dating your daughter in 14 years. Please, no more unnecessary clutter of words. I'm not the only person in my position seeking helpful answers who are reading this forum.
     
  16. cbg

    cbg Super Moderator

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    No one here is going to advise you to do anything other that what your attorney tells you to do.
     
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  17. cbg

    cbg Super Moderator

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    I have been asked by another member to post the following:

    1) The modern spelling is "demonize". Using an archaic spelling doesn't make you sound intelligent.
    2) Save the money to get the court ordered mental health eval, etc., before you even consider retaining a lawyer.
     
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