New York , I'm an adult and should know better, but I messed up big time. I've been shoplifting at a local retail store on a regular basis, last week I was caught. First offense. I am sick to my stomach from the moment I wake until I fall asleep. Yes, most probably because I was caught, however, I am greatly remorseful and I know I will never ever do this again; not ever. All the guilt I feel and humiliation of people finding out about this is not worth it. I did not admit any wrong doing, all items were in the open sitting in the shopping cart, the total was $151. I was asked if I had money to pay for it and I nodded that I did. There was nothing hidden on my person. They did photograph me holding a paper they had me sign stating that I could not trespass for two years. The police were called, I was taken in hand cuffs to the police station, I was not questioned, nor did I volunteer any information; I was photographed again and fingerprinted. I have a court appearance in two weeks. I hired an attorney. I was told that I would be pleading 'not guilty'. This was the biggest mistake of my life and really don't have a good excuse as to why I continued to take what was not mine, except to say the more that I got away with it the more I kept it up. The store wanted me to sign a paper that had to do with Civil Restitution; he said I had ten days to pay them $500, but I declined to sign it. I thought that since I did not sign that paper, that they would mail it to me, but it has been one week and I have not received anything in the mail from them. My attorney told me to ignore anything I get in the mail from them. I keep thinking that if they were to go back and watch surveillance video's for the previous few weeks that they will see me not going through a checkout and figure out that I have done this before and got away with it. Is there even a remote possibility that this could happen? Would this be considered evidence/proof that I had done it before? If the video shows me leaving the store without going thru a checkout can they charge me for those times also? How long do stores usually keep these video's? My mind is playing tricks on me and I can't eat or sleep. I am wondering why I have not received that Civil Restitution for the $500; could it be because there could be additional charges in the works? What is your best guess as to the penalties i am facing.
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Shoplifting, Larceny, Robbery, Theft can shoplifting charges get any worse?
- Thread Starter franc
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jacksgal
New Member
If they have reason to believe there may be other thefts they "might" view old video footage. Why some Attorneys tell clients not to pay civil demand is beyond me the consequences can be severe, costly and life changing. Civil Demand is state law and unless your not guilty the law is on their side. In my signatur eline is a link its a forum (like this one) that is just for shoplifting issues. The experts there can help you as well
fredrikklaw
Moderator
Long answer to a short question!
Franc:
Take your attorney's good directives and advice to not only ignore any and all so-called "Civil Restitution" demands from the store, which is really a euphemism for Civil Shakedown and wholly unnecessary in this particular instance, but also to enter a plea of not guilty when arraigned, and I will give you my rationale.
But first, take my lay-advice to eat heartily and sleep soundly and do not fret any more over what other horrible things might be in the offing for your shoplifting indiscretion. Being contrite is one thing, but to be scared witless over a run-of-the-mill, petty offense such as this is quite another. Because all things considered, including the overall nature and quality of the offense, the sum total of all the resulting punishments and or repercussions, civil or criminal, would be the equivalent of a slap on the wrist you got from your mother when she caught you with your hand in the cookie jar.
You should ignore the Civil Restitution demands because you have already paid total penance for the offense and remember that "Civil" is the operative word here. You were made to pay for the merchandise (and rightly so) and are restrained from frequenting that store for two years. You paid the social penance by the two bouts of severe public embarrassment you suffered (again rightly so) when you were detained first by the security staff and then hauled away in handcuffs by the local cavalry.
Also, civil demands can be made at any time during the relevant statute of limitations but not beyond it. The demands come from the store's legal department and makes it clear on the face of it that if not paid, civil legal action will be taken and nothing more. Show me a company who is going to waste thousands of dollars to obtain a maybe, may-be-not judgment and then waste few other thousands trying to collect on the judgment and you can come to my house and meet Santa Clause.
Now, different companies have different policies with regards to maintenance of security video recordings. But there is nothing to worry about even if this company's policy is to retain every second of every recorded surveillance video starting from when Nixon was president until Hell freezes over. No company is going to waste time and energy reviewing surveillance tapes going back even a day in order to nab someone with another claim of shoplifting. Because contrary to belief and all urban legends, surveillance cameras' main purpose is not to capture footage of someone lifting a T-shirt, but of the "oooooh, help, my back, my leg, my…" brigade, otherwise known as the slip-and-fall con artists who look to take a store on the back of a staged fall, or such and thus.
Last but not least, the reason I agree with entering a plea of not guilty is not to deny reality, but the fact that the plea will set in motion a series of events starting with a an evidentiary hearing and a whole lot of discovery plus motions for this and motion for that, before a trial date is even set which may take around 6 months at least. And therein lays the excellent prospect of the company not be willing to participate in the proceedings due to the time and costs involved. And when there is no victim or witness willing to testify, then the D.A. has no case and will have to dismiss.
But even if they do, you will be offered the same deal when Trial Readiness hearing comes around as if you plead guilty on your arraignment. Which will be a misdemeanor petty conviction with a two-year summary probation, and that will be it.
So, in sum (I always wanted to say that) and as my own beloved attorney always says; once you are out of the lion's den unscathed, don't go back in, you may not be so fortunate next time.
fredrikklaw
Franc:
Take your attorney's good directives and advice to not only ignore any and all so-called "Civil Restitution" demands from the store, which is really a euphemism for Civil Shakedown and wholly unnecessary in this particular instance, but also to enter a plea of not guilty when arraigned, and I will give you my rationale.
But first, take my lay-advice to eat heartily and sleep soundly and do not fret any more over what other horrible things might be in the offing for your shoplifting indiscretion. Being contrite is one thing, but to be scared witless over a run-of-the-mill, petty offense such as this is quite another. Because all things considered, including the overall nature and quality of the offense, the sum total of all the resulting punishments and or repercussions, civil or criminal, would be the equivalent of a slap on the wrist you got from your mother when she caught you with your hand in the cookie jar.
You should ignore the Civil Restitution demands because you have already paid total penance for the offense and remember that "Civil" is the operative word here. You were made to pay for the merchandise (and rightly so) and are restrained from frequenting that store for two years. You paid the social penance by the two bouts of severe public embarrassment you suffered (again rightly so) when you were detained first by the security staff and then hauled away in handcuffs by the local cavalry.
Also, civil demands can be made at any time during the relevant statute of limitations but not beyond it. The demands come from the store's legal department and makes it clear on the face of it that if not paid, civil legal action will be taken and nothing more. Show me a company who is going to waste thousands of dollars to obtain a maybe, may-be-not judgment and then waste few other thousands trying to collect on the judgment and you can come to my house and meet Santa Clause.
Now, different companies have different policies with regards to maintenance of security video recordings. But there is nothing to worry about even if this company's policy is to retain every second of every recorded surveillance video starting from when Nixon was president until Hell freezes over. No company is going to waste time and energy reviewing surveillance tapes going back even a day in order to nab someone with another claim of shoplifting. Because contrary to belief and all urban legends, surveillance cameras' main purpose is not to capture footage of someone lifting a T-shirt, but of the "oooooh, help, my back, my leg, my…" brigade, otherwise known as the slip-and-fall con artists who look to take a store on the back of a staged fall, or such and thus.
Last but not least, the reason I agree with entering a plea of not guilty is not to deny reality, but the fact that the plea will set in motion a series of events starting with a an evidentiary hearing and a whole lot of discovery plus motions for this and motion for that, before a trial date is even set which may take around 6 months at least. And therein lays the excellent prospect of the company not be willing to participate in the proceedings due to the time and costs involved. And when there is no victim or witness willing to testify, then the D.A. has no case and will have to dismiss.
But even if they do, you will be offered the same deal when Trial Readiness hearing comes around as if you plead guilty on your arraignment. Which will be a misdemeanor petty conviction with a two-year summary probation, and that will be it.
So, in sum (I always wanted to say that) and as my own beloved attorney always says; once you are out of the lion's den unscathed, don't go back in, you may not be so fortunate next time.
fredrikklaw
Last edited:
jacksgal
New Member
and when your sued for thousands and/or see a negative on your credit rating thank the Attorney and above poster for telling you to not pay.
jacksgal
New Member
Some shoplifting facts
Facts:
More than $15 billion worth of goods are stolen from retailers each year. That's more than $35 million per day.
There are approximately 27 million shoplifters (or 1 in 11 people) in our nation today. More than 10 million people have been caught shoplifting in the last five years.
Shoplifting affects more than the offender. It overburdens the police and the courts, adds to a store's security expenses, costs consumers more for goods, costs communities lost dollars in sales taxes and hurts children and families.
Shoplifters steal from all types of stores including department stores, specialty shops, supermarkets, drug stores, discounters, music stores, convenience stores and thrift shops.
There is no profile of a typical shoplifter. Men and women shoplift about equally as often.
Approximately 25 percent of shoplifters are kids, 75 percent are adults. 55 percent of adult shoplifters say they started shoplifting in their teens.
Many shoplifters buy and steal merchandise in the same visit. Shoplifters commonly steal from $2 to $200 per incident depending upon the type of store and item(s) chosen.
Shoplifting is often not a premeditated crime. 73 percent of adult and 72 percent of juvenile shoplifters don't plan to steal in advance.
89 percent of kids say they know other kids who shoplift. 66 percent say they hang out with those kids.
Shoplifters say they are caught an average of only once in every 48 times they steal. They are turned over to the police 50 percent of the time.
Approximately 3 percent of shoplifters are "professionals" who steal solely for resale or profit as a business. These include drug addicts who steal to feed their habit, hardened professionals who steal as a life-style and international shoplifting gangs who steal for profit as a business. "Professional" shoplifters are responsible for 10 percent of the total dollar losses.
The vast majority of shoplifters are "non-professionals" who steal, not out of criminal intent, financial need or greed but as a response to social and personal pressures in their life.
The excitement generated from "getting away with it" produces a chemical reaction resulting in what shoplifters describe as an incredible "rush" or "high" feeling. Many shoplifters will tell you that this high is their "true reward," rather than the merchandise itself.
Drug addicts, who have become addicted to shoplifting, describe shoplifting as equally addicting as drugs.
57 percent of adults and 33 percent of juveniles say it is hard for them to stop shoplifting even after getting caught.
Most non-professional shoplifters don't commit other types of crimes. They'll never steal an ashtray from your house and will return to you a $20 bill you may have dropped. Their criminal activity is restricted to shoplifting and therefore, any rehabilitation program should be "offense-specific" for this crime.
Habitual shoplifters steal an average of 1.6 times per week.
Facts:
More than $15 billion worth of goods are stolen from retailers each year. That's more than $35 million per day.
There are approximately 27 million shoplifters (or 1 in 11 people) in our nation today. More than 10 million people have been caught shoplifting in the last five years.
Shoplifting affects more than the offender. It overburdens the police and the courts, adds to a store's security expenses, costs consumers more for goods, costs communities lost dollars in sales taxes and hurts children and families.
Shoplifters steal from all types of stores including department stores, specialty shops, supermarkets, drug stores, discounters, music stores, convenience stores and thrift shops.
There is no profile of a typical shoplifter. Men and women shoplift about equally as often.
Approximately 25 percent of shoplifters are kids, 75 percent are adults. 55 percent of adult shoplifters say they started shoplifting in their teens.
Many shoplifters buy and steal merchandise in the same visit. Shoplifters commonly steal from $2 to $200 per incident depending upon the type of store and item(s) chosen.
Shoplifting is often not a premeditated crime. 73 percent of adult and 72 percent of juvenile shoplifters don't plan to steal in advance.
89 percent of kids say they know other kids who shoplift. 66 percent say they hang out with those kids.
Shoplifters say they are caught an average of only once in every 48 times they steal. They are turned over to the police 50 percent of the time.
Approximately 3 percent of shoplifters are "professionals" who steal solely for resale or profit as a business. These include drug addicts who steal to feed their habit, hardened professionals who steal as a life-style and international shoplifting gangs who steal for profit as a business. "Professional" shoplifters are responsible for 10 percent of the total dollar losses.
The vast majority of shoplifters are "non-professionals" who steal, not out of criminal intent, financial need or greed but as a response to social and personal pressures in their life.
The excitement generated from "getting away with it" produces a chemical reaction resulting in what shoplifters describe as an incredible "rush" or "high" feeling. Many shoplifters will tell you that this high is their "true reward," rather than the merchandise itself.
Drug addicts, who have become addicted to shoplifting, describe shoplifting as equally addicting as drugs.
57 percent of adults and 33 percent of juveniles say it is hard for them to stop shoplifting even after getting caught.
Most non-professional shoplifters don't commit other types of crimes. They'll never steal an ashtray from your house and will return to you a $20 bill you may have dropped. Their criminal activity is restricted to shoplifting and therefore, any rehabilitation program should be "offense-specific" for this crime.
Habitual shoplifters steal an average of 1.6 times per week.
army judge
Super Moderator
franc said:
You, as is any criminal defendant, are innocent until proven guilty in a court of law. Heed your attorney's advice at every twist and turn of the criminal injustice process.
You are about to get an inside look at a world few ever see. Learn from the things you see and the people you meet.
Now is not the time to fret and worry. This is, as Frederiklaw has so eloquently stated, a nothing offense, as compared to the flotsam and jetsam you will soon meet and greet.
Keep your mouth closed and your eyes and ears wide open. You'll eventually, if convicted; pay a fine, take a class on honesty or integrity, be placed on a period of probation, do a little community service, and this will be another of your life's lesser moments. The charge will eventually be dismissed (if you do as the powers to be instruct), and you'll walk away with a clean criminal record.
I'm not going to lecture you about what you are alleged to have done. You know all too well about that. In the future, live every moment knowing that God is watching. Make Him and yourself proud!
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jacksgal
New Member
If you plan to fight charge then yes do not pay Civil Demand but be sure you let the law firm know this so they do not take further action. However if you plan a plea deal then I suggest you pay civil demand. The consequences for not paying can be costly and life changing. Remember Civil Demand is state law hard to get around that.
jacksgal
New Member
I have read of person not getting a Civil Demand letter as late as 6 months after incident. It depends on when store submits request and how busy the Civil recovery service is
All those statistics are sobering
Thanks for letting me know
jacksgal
New Member
That 15 billion is just for shoplifting internal theft cost retailers even more!
How do they even begin to deal w/internal theft? I'm assuming it's easy to catch employees, don't know why I think so
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army judge
Super Moderator
pusosl said:
The Express Train to Worryville left on track nine, yesterday. Worry will do you no good.
Pull yourself together. This is your life you're trying to fix. Stop talking, stop worrying, and talk only to your lawyer. This isn't over and Big Bertha isn't singing. You're innocent until proven guilty, or you screw your case up and plead to something. Patience is needed for your own good.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
From your mouth to God's ear … thank you so very much for putting this horrible experience into perspective … my only wish is that some of what you said will come to pass … I know that I have learned my lesson and I will never so much as pick up a jelly bean that I have not paid for … I believe this experience, horrendous as it was, is the only thing that would have put an end to my despicable behavior … and for that, I guess, I will be eternally grateful.
to Army Judge: Words cannot express how grateful I am for your educated opinion … I know I must not rely on it as gospel, however, I'm hopeful that at least I can put this nightmare on a shelf until I have to face the music, and not allow it to occupy my every waking moment … the worst scenario's keep replaying in my brain until I'm ready to explode … I cannot describe how physically sick I become each time I flash back to that day … my stomach is one tremendous sickening knot … I have truly learned my lesson.
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