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How do I get around the restrictive guardianship requirements in Indiana?

Discussion in 'Guardians & Conservators' started by gocubbies317, Aug 28, 2022.

  1. gocubbies317

    gocubbies317 Law Topic Starter New Member

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    I believe I might be in a strange legal place. My son is severely disabled, but he doesn't fall under the criteria for guardianship in my state. Is there some kind of special circumstances rule? Could I just ask the judge? If I can get a hearing, I'm sure the judge will understand the problem here.

    Although he hasn't been diagnosed with any mental condition, Brad is totally blind. He can't even see his own hand in front of his face. He is able to navigate using his cane and operate his smart phone and computer. We've taught him how to use a microwave, air frier, and a toaster, but he has no experience with a stove even though he has watched a lot of Youtube videos with these blind people making complicated meals, and I do fear that he will try to make one of those and either start a fire, burn himself, or not cook the food well enough to avoid getting sick.

    I'm also afraid of other accidents in his home which sight could prevent such as him using a harsh chemical on his body and hair, because they're all in plastic bottles, or him tripping over something he left laying around and hurting himself. I'm also concerned about others taking advantage of him especially after what I have foundout as of late. He has adopted some pretty risky habbits. I wanted to keep this short, so that's the condenced version. I'll put more details below to help you get a clearer picture of what's going on.

    He's twenty five, and I've only been concerned for the past few months, because before, he was married. It was honestly the perfect situation, because she grew-up near here and took care of him when the wife and I would go out. She would always report back to us on what was going on, but they split up right out of the blue. Now, he's living on his own, and he doesn't let us help him. He comes over for dinner once a week, but he doesn't like to answer questions. If we press him, he often lies just to get us off of his case.

    He lives a short drive away in a building meant for disabled and elderly people, but I foundout that there is no assistance available. Its apparently just an apartment complex. Noone checks in on the residents. They don't even have staffmembers available outside of office hours. If its ten o'clock at night, there isn't even a front desk worker to stop him and ask where he's going.

    He won't live in any kind of assisted living facility, because he thinks that my wife and I, or some other sighted people, will try to control his life. He his this rebellious streak like a teenager.

    He won't give us a key or even put us on a list of people allowed to enter his apartment if he's away. Apparently, for his landlord to let us in, he has to be missing for more than forty eight hours, or he has to have died or sufffered some severe illness or something. They won't even give us a fob to enter the building.

    I have been able to strike up a couple friendships in his building, and those folks try to help the best the can, but there's only so much they can do. he's already stopped trusting them.

    Strangely enough, Brad's a pretty trusting guy except for when it comes to us. THat's why I'm worried about someone taking advantage of him. He talks to anyone. he can't see if that person looks shady or disheveled. He could be talking to some homeless bumb, and the guy could claim to be a pastor or someone helping the disabled or elderly, and Brad will just tell him everything. I'm worried about someone trying to scam him out of money or get access to his apartment.

    he does come visit, and we have brought these issues up on a few occasions, but he won't accept any help, and now, he just doesn't tell us things. If we press him, he lies. He has blocked my wife and I on social media, but I know enough of his personal information that I have guessed his passwords. I've been able to see a lot of his online activity, and honestly, it has me worried.

    he's associating with a lot of people who likely don't have his best interests at heart. He walks, all by himself, to these slummy bars in a nightlife district a few blocks from his building. He's added these people on Facebook who cover themselves with tatoos, brag about smoking marijuana and who knows what other drugs, and the women have no selfrespect. These girls are showing off everything. I don't want them doing something nasty with Brad and getting him attatched to them just so they can use him.

    He seems particularly friendly with this one girl who works at one of those bars. She shows off her tatoos and seems to see nothing wrong with marijuana and even something she calls "magic mushrooms," or "shrooms," for short. Its apparently something that makes you hallusinate. What if she's dating brad and getting him hooked on drugs? What if she has him wrapped around her finger because she's doing dirty things to him, and he doesn't know any better. He just knows it feels good. Honestly, I don't think its appropriate for him to be having sex. he just doesn't understand the world like other guys his age. He needs to find a nice girl like the one he was married to, someone more responsible who will love him and take care of him.

    He's started talking about some strange things too. I think he wants to impress some of these women, because they talk about it, and now, his page is covered with these reposts about scaling back the government, restricting the police, legalizing drugs, and even repealing the laws against prostitution.

    I've read some of his online posts, and I think he's even been seeing prostitutes. I want to stop him from doing all of these things, and so far, it appears the legal system won't let me do anything. Is there any way around it?
     
  2. justblue

    justblue Well-Known Member

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    I would advise you to seek therapy for your issues. You are intrusive and bizarrely over involved in your adult sons life. Nothing you have posted indicates he is in need of anything more than a restraining order that would prevent you from harassing him.
     
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  3. stealthy1

    stealthy1 Active Member

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    Not to be rude, but how does he watch YouTube videos if he's totally blind?
     
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  4. adjusterjack

    adjusterjack Super Moderator

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    Not really a legal issue. If the situation doesn't qualify for guardianship then you'll need to just accept the fact that he lives his own life the way he wants to and he will have to pay the price for any mistakes he makes.

    I have had to accept a similar situation with my son. Can't tell him s--t. He's 52 and, well, long story. All I can do is be supportive without interfering, otherwise I'll never hear from him. Sad situation but there is nothing I can do about it.

    Neither can you.

    Time to back off and leave him to his own devices.
     
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  5. Red Kayak

    Red Kayak Well-Known Member

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    I hope Brad strikes up a correspondence with Daniel Kish.
    How I use sonar to navigate the world

    Brad is vision impaired. It takes more than that to be "severely disabled". Your attitude towards blind people is downright Victorian. He is a 25 year old man, acting like a silly 25 year old man. And it's certainly natural for him to distrust you - you're not trustworthy.

    The reason you can't get what you want (guardianship) is because it is unreasonable.

    STOP hacking into his accounts. If you want to help him, teach him how to create stronger passwords. Your ADULT son has rights, and he might yet exert them with a restraining order.
     
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  6. justblue

    justblue Well-Known Member

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    Fascinating, Red. Thank you so much for posting that interesting and educational clip.
     
    leslie82 likes this.
  7. gocubbies317

    gocubbies317 Law Topic Starter New Member

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    He can use a screen reading program on his laptop and his tablet, but he just listens to the audio from the video.

    I've seen them, and they're very convincing, but Brad always gets excited when he sees them. He doesn't realize that they are just for entertainment, and behind the scenes, these people likely have everything done for them.
     
  8. justblue

    justblue Well-Known Member

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    Let your son live his life...before you destroy any relationship you currently have with him.
     
    Red Kayak likes this.
  9. Zigner

    Zigner Well-Known Member

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    Perhaps YOU are the one who doesn't understand.
     
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  10. army judge

    army judge Super Moderator

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    Before I begin, one of the most capable people I've ever known was a blind, high school classmate.

    He graduated high school as our valedictorian.

    Ron was completely blind.

    He navigated the halls of our high school by himself.

    He and I were both in many of the same advanced classes, Algebra/Trig, Analytical Geometry, Physics, Chemistry, Literature, Latin, and Greek.

    Ron and I generally sat near each other, because of our last names.

    The kid was a genius.

    He could do complex math problems in his head.

    We've kept in touch over the years.

    Ron earned a PhD in Chemistry.
    He earned another PhD in Psychology.
    He taught University courses, and conducted medical research.

    Ron was fond of saying, "Blindness isn't a disability, its just a condition. I am the only one who can disable myself, the moment I stop trying."

    Don't view your son's condition as a disability.
    If you help him, not hobble him, he can achieve many things.



    No one is legally able to "get around" our laws.
    If one disregards our laws, he/she is considered a SCOFFLAW.

    WHAT IS A GUARDIANSHIP?
    A legal proceeding to appointing an individual responsible to the court to care/protect an incapacitated adult, who also manages/guards the incapacitated person's assets.

    WHAT ARE THE DIFFERENCES BETWEEN GUARDIANSHIP AND A POWER OF ATTORNEY

    A power of attorney is voluntary; a Guardianship can be voluntary or involuntary

    A power of attorney is easily revoked; a Guardianship can only be terminated by a court order

    A power of attorney is made by someone who is competent; a Guardianship usually involves someone who is incompetent because of age or health

    A power of attorney is private and does not involve a court; a Guardianship involves court proceedings

    An attorney in fact under a power of attorney has less formal accountability than a Guardian

    Applying for Adult Guardianship in Indiana
    A person interested in guardianship should first seek the help of an attorney to guide them through the process and help them fill out the necessary documents. The proposed guardian should thoroughly understand the ward's health and finances. If, for example, health issues incapacitate the protected person, the person seeking guardianship should get a doctor's report or a letter stating that the ward cannot take care of themselves or manage their finances.

    After filing a petition with the court, the person who wishes to have guardianship must notify the allegedly incapacitated person, their immediate family members and any entity with care or custody of the protected person within 60 days. If the protected person consents to the petition or cannot respond to it due to their disability, the court will hold a hearing to allow witnesses to provide sworn testimony supporting the allegations in the petition.

    If the court deems the evidence sufficient, it will appoint the guardian and issue legal documents known as "letters of guardianship," permitting the guardian to act on behalf of the incapacitated person.

    What determines an incapacitated adult in Indiana?

    Indiana Code > Title 29 > Article 3 – Guardianships and Protective Proceedings » LawServer

    Guardianship & Alternatives to Guardianship | The Arc of Indiana

    Guardianship process in Indiana:

    Guardianship - Indiana Legal Help
    ...
     
  11. Red Kayak

    Red Kayak Well-Known Member

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    That ship has sailed.

    There's a reason why he won't allow them a spare key to his apartment: he doesn't trust them.

    You mean this wasn't spontaneous?
     
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  12. Zigner

    Zigner Well-Known Member

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    Along similar lines, as a youth (late 70's/early 80's), I also had a good friend who was blind. I remember how well he was able to navigate the world. I also remember that he was an excellent softball player, assuming you used the special softball that beeped. He also whipped my butt every time on a handheld electronic baseball game. Yes, he needed accommodations, but not nearly as much as a sighted person may think.
     
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  13. leslie82

    leslie82 Well-Known Member

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    He hasn’t been diagnosed with any mental conditions but you think he’s blind? I don’t know what blindness has to do with mental conditions…did you take him to an optometrist to see if he is blind? It doesn’t really sound like he is blind. I mean…I have horrible eye vision but glasses corrects it to allow me to see. Without glasses, I have to have something damn near in front of my face otherwise it’s blurry.

    So wait a minute – he’s been married and your daughter in law never brought up his sight issues? Also what do you mean his wife took care of him when you and your wife went out? Were they living with you? If he’s living alone, how do you know all that goes on in his home? I’m so confused…


    How does he live in a “building meant for disabled and elderly” but it has no staff? I’m even more confused now. It sounds like he’s able to manage on his own so why does he need an assisted living facility? I’m not surprised he won’t give you a key…

    It sounds like you want to control your son and he doesn’t want you to. He’s 25 and sounds like he’s able to take care of himself. There’s obviously a reason he doesn’t want to visit you…maybe dwell on the past as to what trauma you likely caused. Wait you hacked into his accounts??? Seriously?

    Lol “added people on Facebook covered in tattoos, brag about smoking marijuana and the women have no self respect.” Ok boomer. Nothing wrong with tattoos or even marijuana. Especially when it’s legal in most states. Do you worry about people who drink alcohol or smoke cigarettes? Those are worse than marijuana. What if she gets him hooked on drugs? That’s his choice he made if he participates in drug use. Honestly kudos to your son if he’s getting some action – maybe you should focus on your relationship with your wife. She sounds a bit neglected…

    If you think your son is a danger to himself or others, call the police. Otherwise, mind your own business. He’s an adult. He can make whatever choices he wants, even if they aren’t in his best interest. You have serious issues. Seek some help for yourself.


     

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