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Former Employer Filed an Appeal

Discussion in 'Unemployment Insurance & Benefits' started by DC77, Jan 5, 2022.

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  1. PayrollHRGuy

    PayrollHRGuy Well-Known Member

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    If you didn't take reasonable methods to correct, "safety concerns and ethics concerns" that can get you disqualified.

    If you quit "primarily for an internship" that will also likely get you DQ'd.
     
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  2. Zigner

    Zigner Well-Known Member

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    OP was advised that it would not. I really believe this is all about who the benefits get charged to, not whether he's qualified.
     
  3. PayrollHRGuy

    PayrollHRGuy Well-Known Member

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    I think either the OP misunderstood whoever he spoke to or they were wrong. UI is not meant to be an income while people work for free or go to school. For example, if someone leaves a job to go to law school they don't get UI.
     
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  4. cbg

    cbg Super Moderator

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    I agree that you cannot quit to go back to school and expect to get UI.

    However, my state has a program for unemployed folks who cannot find work in their field. Under this program, they can retrain for a new field. It has to be an approved program of study and you have to be accepted into the state's program before you enroll in school, but if accepted you can to go school for up to 26 weeks and receive UI without having to complete a job search.
     
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  5. PayrollHRGuy

    PayrollHRGuy Well-Known Member

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    There is no evidence that the OP was in such a program.
     
  6. commentator

    commentator Member

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    Honestly, in the last two years, all the info you want to dig up is off the table. The workload and procedures of the unemployment system in every state was turned on its ears to the point the people working there didn't have a clue. And hearings as such, regarding eligibility, just did not happen. When people who would never have qualified under any circumstances were being approved right and left, following the normal processes are off the table. In the name of getting some cash out fast to all sorts of people who were out of work for all sorts of reasons, money was approved and sent in hundreds of thousands of cases of claims that would never have been approved in the olden days. Most of the money came from the federal government, some of the money came from employer accounts as it did in the regular times.

    And these hundreds of thousands of people have mostly now moved on and gone from the program. To adjudicate all these past claims, determine eligibility and actually demand repayments, etc. would be a task beyond comprehension on any scale.

    And like the IRS, if you at this time hired a hundred thousand new staff members for the state's departments to do this, it would be another two or three years until they could be trained into any sort of valid work productivity. Will not happen.

    My state has now passed legislation butchering the state's unemployment benefits program, cutting eligibility time and payment amounts, trying to make sure nobody ever gets approved for benefits again ever. UNLESS of course, they are out of work due to refusing to get a COVID vaccination. Then they qualify for unemployment automatically. The governor, a famously inexperienced small business owner who became governor, screamed, "WHAT?" and vetoed that law. It passed anyway.

    Based on a lifetime of working in this department and with this program, in my professional opinion, this woman's eligibility for benefits is NOT being questioned. A notice that their employer account is being charged a small part for her benefits has finally been sent out to one of her base period employers. She has long since stopped receiving benefits. I used to send out these darn reports to employers. They always have the right to appeal these charges. They are beating a dead horse. We should stop doing this.
     
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2022
  7. PayrollHRGuy

    PayrollHRGuy Well-Known Member

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    I'm not disagreeing with you but that really doesn't have anything with if the OP was in a program such as CBG mentioned.

    And I do agree that in every state that I know of the UI system failed completely during COVID.
     
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  8. cbg

    cbg Super Moderator

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    No, I agree. I'm just responding to the blanket statement that you can't collect UI while going to school.
     
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  9. DC77

    DC77 Law Topic Starter Member

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    Hi All, if it helps the discussion, I was working while I was in school prior to covid. School was a career change from technical desk work to healthcare. I was laid off during covid, which is when I applied for benefits. When things started to reopen, jobs were slim. I couldn’t find anything in my prior career field.

    I took a chance taking the job with the employer in question at a clinic. It was for 1 day a week with some fill in hours, which qualified me for partial benefits. He filed the appeal while I was still employed and eligible for partial benefits. Who it should have been billed to is beyond me.

    If there’s a question of losing benefits for leaving for the internship, I think it would have been at the end of my time working for the employer, which we were not able to sort out a date in the hearing. But even then, I was told by unemployment I was still eligible because it was full time and on the job training. But as someone mentioned, I could have been misinformed. I also continued to look for work and had the option to postpone internships for 18 months to work. Obviously, I wasn’t going to postpone real on the job training towards my certification to work 1 day a week in a defunct clinic. I could not find any other real full time work. I still can’t for that matter. I’m working 2 part time jobs, not related to either career.
     
    Last edited: Jan 23, 2022
  10. DC77

    DC77 Law Topic Starter Member

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    Hi All! @commentator @Zigner @PayrollHRGuy @army judge (apologies if I miss anyone) the determination is in, and she sided with the employer. And it was in fact about my eligibility! I was deemed ineligible after the date of my initial resignation, even though I continued working there for 2 more months. I guess the “she quit she quit she quit no take backs!” strategy worked. Apparently my hours were reduced at my own fault for the resignation.

    They’ve already sent me a request for overpayment of $2,336. I’m not sure if that includes the federal money or not because it is carried out to the end of August, which would not be near enough. But I can’t figure out their math. I also believe there is a typo in the judgement. It is marked as February 14 as my initial resignation date though it was actually March 14. It’s a difference of 3-4 weeks. This was recorded correctly in the hearing notes but not in the determination... I have 10 days to appeal.
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2022
  11. DC77

    DC77 Law Topic Starter Member

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    I expect I will be receiving something from federal. Then we’re talking about $7,000. I don’t have this kind of money.
     
  12. army judge

    army judge Super Moderator

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    If you owe the gubmint a sum of money you can't pay in full, you ask for PAYMENT arrangements.

    If granted, you are permiited to pay the gubmint agtency a set amount of money each month until the debt has been paid on full.

    If you suddenly come into a sum of money during the payment arrangement scheme, you can always pay the balance in full.

    By the way, if you do nothing, the gubmint will make your life more miserable than you can imagine.
     
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  13. Zigner

    Zigner Well-Known Member

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    File an appeal - you don't need to state any reasons for appealing.
     
  14. Redemptionman

    Redemptionman Active Member

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    I am not shocked that they sided with the employer, see post #38.

    You do have an option as you can appeal the determination letter within a set period of time.

    I would recommend talking to a good labor attorney who handles these board cases on the side, although you are in a tight spot as you are appealing this time. Up to you but is 200 bucks worth the roll of the dice to maybe get this over turned and not have to pay back 7k?

    You only have a finite time to appeal the determination, the clock is ticking.
     
  15. DC77

    DC77 Law Topic Starter Member

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    I need to cut my losses. If I keep pushing, he will come after me any harder and any way he can. Bullying is his method, and frankly it’s working. I have to worry about survival right now.

    I’ll appeal the correction of the dates. File a waiver for forgiveness. And go from there... I followed the direction of DES agents the entire time to try to do everything correctly. It’s an incredibly frustrating and unfortunate situation with a despicable specimen of a human being, but I have to put my energy into getting another career off the ground.
     
  16. Redemptionman

    Redemptionman Active Member

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    I hate employers like that which bully and intimidate, the only way to win is to do it back.

    I had a similar situation a few decades ago with a manager, the only reason I won is due to the fact that I had an attorney who worked these appeal board meetings on the side. You are always better off with an attorney than with out. He turned the tables and I won but I ended up giving around half the money back to them because I was working and did not need it. UI benefits are a benefit and when you pay that back it replenishes the fund to help other people.

    Felt it was the right thing to do even though I won the determination and could have kept the money. Up to you if you want to pursue it. Tough decisions are hard sometimes and sometimes it doesn't work.
     
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  17. DC77

    DC77 Law Topic Starter Member

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    This is probably the longest string ever. I apologize...

    Does anyone on here know about the appeals process? Is the first determination set in stone by some legal means? I don't want to file an appeal and drag this out if I don't have to, ready to move on, but they recorded the initial separation date incorrectly. It's clearly written in the hearing notes as MARCH, but it was recorded and calculated as February. Nothing else aligns with that February date. And this date was weeks before I even sent the email notice to leave. It doesn't make any sense and it's an entire month of overpayment I don't think I should owe...

    Does anyone know if this is something they can go back and change because of their error? Or am I going to have to go through the entire appeals process to get it changed?

    I tried calling DES. When I couldn't get through, I contacted the referee. It was out of her hands and determined by adjudicators. She referred me back to the call center. I've been trying for 2 days to get through. I can't even get into a hold queue. It just hangs up. I've sent an email through the appeals e-address. I have until Monday to figure this out... I've been reading that NC is one of the WORST states for unemployment customer services and incompetence. I'm believing it.
     
  18. PayrollHRGuy

    PayrollHRGuy Well-Known Member

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    It has been explained to you here and I would be VERY surprised if the next step in the appeals process wasn't fully explained within the decision letter you received.

    But again the next step is the Board of Review. DES: Board of Review
     
  19. army judge

    army judge Super Moderator

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    Here's a thought from the old days.

    You could always visit a DES location in person and learn more about how to resolve the matter.

    In the meantime, file the appeal.

    Get the ball rolling.

    Don't get caught asleep at the wheel.

    WHAT MUST MY APPEAL CONTAIN?

    An initial, first level appeal must:

    Be in writing. An electronic or online written statement is sufficient.
    State that you appeal or disagree with the determination or ruling.
    State the Issue ID number or Docket number that you are appealing.
    State your full name, and, if you are with an employer, your title.
    State your contact information, including your phone number(s) and email addresses.

    You may also include a detailed statement of why you are appealing for the appeals referee to review, along with any evidence you would like considered as part of your appeals hearing. No particular form is required for an initial appeal.

    Forget about what you'll say, just complete the forms and get it into the hands of the DES, so you don't get slapped down on a technicality.

    Here's where you start:

    DES: Appeals

    The preferred and fastest way to appeal a determination made by the Division of the Employment Security is through the DES online benefits system.

    Once an appeal is filed, DES will schedule a hearing on your appeal.

    A notice of hearing containing the date, time and contact information for the designated appeals referee will be sent to you.

    File an Appeal ===> DES: File an Appeal

    Things that cannot be appealed include:

    Pending issues
    Incomplete or pending claims
    Monetary determinations, including “monetarily ineligible” claim status
    Wage protests
    Weekly benefit amounts
    Excessive earnings/wages preventing benefit payment
    Weekly certifications
    Claim effective dates, requests to back-date a claim
    Waiting week waivers

    These issues can be addressed by contacting the Customer Call Center DES: Contact Us or the Employer Call Center.
     
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  20. Redemptionman

    Redemptionman Active Member

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    all states are like that right now. If you have sent an email requesting an appeal they should honor it. Usually it is 10 business days but your state could be different. Keep trying till you get through, usually early morning right as they open is the best time to call.

    You have a right to appeal the agency determination and they can schedule a hearing for said determination. If they ask you a grounds just say general and then go find yourself an attorney who works these on the side and can help you. You could still lose but at least they would take you more seriously.
     
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