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Stimulus Thievery

Discussion in 'Other Debt, Collection, Garnishment' started by M. Williams, Jun 26, 2020.

  1. M. Williams

    M. Williams Law Topic Starter New Member

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    Jurisdiction:
    California
    Regarding this Stimulus, and the State STEALING it from those who owe back child support.


    All I'm looking for is the # of the form I need to file in order to get myself in front of a Judge in the county of the case. Pretty simple, but I'm finding it almost impossible to get the answer to my question.

    Thank You
     
  2. Zigner

    Zigner Well-Known Member

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    Recovery of child support is specifically allowed in the legislation that authorized the stimulus payments...
    (and you thought you'd get away with not paying what you owe...muahahah)
     
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  3. M. Williams

    M. Williams Law Topic Starter New Member

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    Did I ask for advice?

    Are the rest of the members in this forum like YOU?

    You're a CHILD who needs to be given the boot.

    Btw, the stimulus IS NOT a TAX RETURN, and legally CANNOT be considered as one if the person in question doesn't pay income taxes -- which I DO NOT!!!

    . . . and you thought you were so cute.


    I have a LEGAL arguement that's loaded with MERIT, and I know I do.

    Please allow someone else to answer my question. After-all, that's what the forum is all about.
     
  4. cbg

    cbg Super Moderator

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    Then you find yourself a lawyer that will find you the form you need. You won't get any help here.
     
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  5. stealthy1

    stealthy1 New Member

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    I agree that you should speak with an attorney. I doubt you'll find much satisfaction.
     
  6. flyingron

    flyingron Active Member

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    The check you get from the feds is never a "tax return" anyhow. The tax return is the thing you file. The check is a refund. You're operating under the fallacy that tax refunds are the only thing that is attachable for state child support arrearage. That's far from the truth. All sorts of federal pay and pensions are attachable. As a matter of fact, very little is not attachable. Stuff that's normally off limits to creditors (workmans comp, old-age benefits, etc...) is. As you were told early on, your stimulus benefit is CERTAINLY attachable.

    Here's the California self help site for your category of complaint: Child Support - support_famlaw_selfhelp
     
  7. Tax Counsel

    Tax Counsel Well-Known Member

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    Then you evidently didn't read the statute that created the stimulus payments. The CARES act § 2201(a) specifically adds the stimulus payments as Section 6428 of the Internal Revenue Code (IRC) — and thus a tax provision. It starts by providing the following in subsection (a):

    (a) In general.--In the case of an eligible individual, there shall be allowed as a credit against the tax imposed by subtitle A for the first taxable year beginning in 2020 an amount equal to the sum of--
    (1) $1,200 ($2,400 in the case of eligible individuals filing a joint return), plus
    (2) an amount equal to the product of $500 multiplied by the number of qualifying children (within the meaning of section 24(c)) of the taxpayer.
    So, as you can see, the stimulus payments are treated as a tax credit on your 2020 return. Furthermore, subsection (b) says that this credit is to be treated as a refundable tax credit. Congress did not want the public to have to wait until next year when returns would be filed to get this credit, so subsection (f)(3)(A) states that the government will refund that amount as soon as possible. Specifically, it says:

    (A) Timing.--The Secretary shall, subject to the provisions of this title, refund or credit any overpayment attributable to this section as rapidly as possible. No refund or credit shall be made or allowed under this subsection after December 31, 2020.

    So the stimulus payment is a tax credit and that credit was sent out as an advance refund of tax. Refunds of tax are subject, however, to certain offsets for other debts the person owes. All of those refund offsets are either debts owed to federal or state government agencies or child support/alimony obligations. Congress did not want the stimulus payments offset to other government debts, but did want it offset for child support. Thus, the CARES Act § 2201(d) turns off all the offsets to government obligations. Pointedly, though, it did not turn off the child support offset.

    You can read the text of the CARES Act yourself to see that it is indeed treated as a tax refund. It is Section 2201 of the Act and that starts on page 55.

    As a result, I don't see that you have any viable claim against either the federal government or the state unless you were not delinquent on your child support payments.


    That will depend on what agency you plan to sue and what theory you are going to use for your claim. That matters because depending on those details you may have to sue in federal court rather than state court and you might have to take some administrative steps first before filing a claim in court. If you care to provide those details then I may be able to give you the info on the general process you'd have to follow.

    But just based on what you've said here so far, I think you'll end up losing on this, and will end up out the filing fees and other costs you spend in the process. You might even get penalized by the court for filing a frivolous claim.
     
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  8. flyingron

    flyingron Active Member

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    As TM points out the law allows them to attach your payment. If you want to argue that you shouldn't owe the money they're reclaiming, then follow the state info I posted above
     
  9. adjusterjack

    adjusterjack Super Moderator

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    The CA court website has a ton of forms. They are listed at:

    Browse All Forms - forms_and_rules

    If you cannot find the form on the list you'll have to create your petition yourself or with the help of an attorney.

    The reality is that you probably don't because of the way the law is written. But good luck if you want to give it a try.
     
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  10. army judge

    army judge Super Moderator

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    Even if you had asked for "advice", it can't be found here.

    You, however, voluntarily arrived here seeking information.

    That is all we dispense here, information, not advice.

    Each of our forum participants are unique human beings, that also includes you, fellow "homo sapiens".

    Now why would anyone desire to attack a child using a boot?

    In some quarters, using a boot to discipline a child could result in criminal charges being lodged against the alleged perpetrator of that dastardly misdeed.



    The money doled out under the CARES Act came from uncle Sammy's IRS.

    I doubt that a CA state court judge has the power to order one of Uncle Sammy's federal agencies to return money allegedly taken from you, EVEN IF such monies were snatched illegally.

    If a legal remedy exists through the court system, it MIGHT start with a federal court.

    Even if such a remedy exists, expect to spend anywhere from three to five years pursuing it.

    Happy hunting, mate, and best of luck with your legal endeavors.
     
  11. Zigner

    Zigner Well-Known Member

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    No, there is absolutely no merit in your position. Good day.
     
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  12. zddoodah

    zddoodah Well-Known Member

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    If you're going to characterize this as "STEALING," then at least be consistent and refer to "those who owe back child support" as "DEADBEAT PARENTS."

    That's because there is no single "form" that you can use for this purpose. Even if there is a legal basis for getting the money, you're unlikely to be able to accomplish it with a pre-printed form.

    Yes. Read the "Legal Disclaimer" that appears at the bottom of every page at this site. It says, among other things, "When you submit a question or make a comment on our site or in our law forum, you clearly imply that you are interested in receiving answers, opinions and responses from other people."
     
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