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Non disclosure of an auto repair Consumer Fraud

Discussion in 'Consumer Fraud & Scams' started by Ichu, May 20, 2019.

  1. Ichu

    Ichu Law Topic Starter New Member

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    On March 15,My daughters car enroute to work 2011 camry) stopped,so it was towed to my regular mechanic.An hour later, she was there and the owner right away said,it needs new engine.My initial reaction was to decline because its an old car & new engine is expensive esp that its ACs been out for several months.But they insisted to give me a good deal. A few days,they offered $2500 and 400 for AC.I still said no because what if other major repairs like transmission or timing belts occur.I then asked if they have other used cars (ive bought a good used car from them before), they said yes we have a couple. So the next, my daughter and I drove to the shop, unfortunately, one car was sold,the other was pending. Then they convinced me again,mentioning i just registered this car in January,if i buy another used car is no guarantee plus i have to get it smogged then register to my name, extra costs. So i asked again,about transmission and other major repairs,ive asked a few friends and they all mentioned these parts as i know nothing about cars.Their reply was “ After the engine changed, it will run for another 4-5 years with just minor repairs like brakes or tires, transmission and timing belts are all good!”.That sparkled my daughter to just do it because she just graduated from college last year and was just doing a temp job, she wasnt ready for a newer car with her student loans.The next day, my daughter went back with their $ 1T required deposit.She recieved a paper that says , Estimate dated March 15, below has a first line for $75 -check & report, test drive, no oil indicated, lift up visual check dated March 25 @ 11 am. Next line $ 2500-engine replaced, $ 1T , my daughters signature @ 6 pm. The next day i asked about $75 and i was told, a diagnostic fee, which will be removed after the job is done.Few days later, they called saying “AC blowing very cold air,new engine is good,but transmission is bad!”. I was schocked! I said “ oh no , ill just cancell the order then, thats a pricey repair, You assured me , the transmission is still good “!..They said, don’t worry well give you a good deal ( their famous line ) came back with $ 1800. I said, now this will cost me almost $5T, money i dont have. They refused to my request and want to keep my car and my deposit. I called the corporate office but was instantly shot down.I seek help with Business Bureau which took over a month. The whole time,we went through crazy schedule of uber and helping my daughter to get to work and back.First,they lowered the transmission to $ 1200 then finally $3500 for everything.By this time, my daughter got hired with a better job and decided to get a newer car plus I didn’t trust what type of job will result after the issues.I offered to just get $ 500 and i will write off the car to them,they still declined. I wanted to file to small claims court but they beat me with a mechanical lein on my car. I know if ignore the lein, ill be in trouble, as of today, i only have 3-4 days to reply to the DMV.Can i get legal assistance here please if i have a case or they are right that the job is done i have to pay, or i can argue that i feel violated for not informing me that a transmission cannot be evaluated unless engine is running ( this is their argument) which was not disclosed to me not to mention the fact that i did ask about this.I wont pay for just the engine and AC knowing that the transmission is bad. As a mother I would never put my child’s life in danger and as a human being , other peoples lives too. Please help.
     
  2. army judge

    army judge Super Moderator

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    coolstoryexpertneed.jpg toolongsteviewonder.jpg coolstorybrotellitagain.jpg
     
  3. Ichu

    Ichu Law Topic Starter New Member

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  4. Zigner

    Zigner Well-Known Member

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    Whose car is it? I mean...whose name is on the title?
    You didn't actually ask a question. I'm not sure what can be done to help. You approved the repair.
     
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  5. justblue

    justblue Well-Known Member

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    Or, rather than getting snippy, you could just post a "to the point" paragraph with an actual question.

    Hint...Questions have a ? after them. Your long, and sadly lacking in white space, opening post had no ?.
     
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  6. Ichu

    Ichu Law Topic Starter New Member

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    It my car , with my daughters name added as a driver in the insurance. Yes i approved the repair, but i wasn’t willing to just drive it away with a bad transmission. I was willing to take $ 500 off my deposit then ill sign the title to them. My question is if i take it to small claims court , do i have a chance on my argument that , yes the engine and AC was done , but it wasn’t disclosed that transmission is bad , so if pay for it , ill drive away with a car that has new engine but bad transmission, i felt trapped.
     
  7. Zigner

    Zigner Well-Known Member

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    In my opinion, no, you don't have any real chance at winning in court. You approved the work. You know that a transmission can't be tested if the car isn't running (and if you claim you don't in court, it will be as unbelievable there as it is here.)

    Edit: On the bright side, you'd have a car with a new engine, AC and transmission.
     
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  8. Ichu

    Ichu Law Topic Starter New Member

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    I didnt know that the transmission cannot be tested if engine is not running, thats why i repeatedly asked , i even asked for timing belts too and they responded that all these parts are good . I would have never agreed to get the engine changed if i know that transmission or other major parts cannot be tested if the engine is not running. I dont know anything about cars. Most mothers I know that I called if this is worth doing , said yes if thats the only problem, thats why they all suggested to ask about transmission and timing belts.
    Plus with the invoice which stated $ 75 as diagnostic fee , I assumed that part of that fee is to check all parts . As i said, just barely minutes after the car was in the shop , immediately the mechanic said , its the engine.,
     
  9. justblue

    justblue Well-Known Member

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    I know when faced with a car repair that will cost 2k, the first people I call for advice are my sewing club...
    o_O
    Why didn't you just get a second opinion from a mechanic?
     
  10. Zigner

    Zigner Well-Known Member

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    The timing belt would be replaced with the engine, so,yes, it's new. The transmission may well have looked fine to them. The diagnostic fee is to get your foot in the door, so to speak.
     
  11. Ichu

    Ichu Law Topic Starter New Member

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    I know that my mistake was calling mommies , I didn’t think this mechanic will do this to me , because im friends with them , i have been going to them for over 15 years . I even bought a used car from them before .
     
  12. mightymoose

    mightymoose Moderator

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    Your best bet may be to pay what is owed for repairs and sell the car for as much as you can. It doesn't sound like the dealership has done anything wrong.
    In the future, shop around a bit and get a few estimates before authorizing repairs.
     
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  13. army judge

    army judge Super Moderator

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    The 2011 Toyota Camry does not have a timing belt, it has a timing chain.

    There is no change interval on the Camry.

    Toyota Timing Belt and Timing Chain List

    Camry 1990-2001 = Belt
    Camry 2002-2017 = Chain



    camrytiming_belt_chain.png
     
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  14. KatDini

    KatDini Well-Known Member

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    And a chain can go at any time since they aren't changed like timing belts (for the non-mechanicky folks). And when a chain goes, the engine is pretty much useless. It's like the Spanish Inquisition. No-one expects the Spanish Inquisition!
     
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  15. justblue

    justblue Well-Known Member

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    :D You made me lol...
     
  16. Disabled Vet

    Disabled Vet Well-Known Member

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    Agree... Unless you got them to put in writing that the transmission was good. I would pay the repairs. Let her drive it around for a few years. Honestly, That isn't a bad price for the engine swap. Transmission is a little pricey. Pay and drive to get your money back.
     
  17. Ichu

    Ichu Law Topic Starter New Member

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    So the diagnostic fee was a trap ?the judge wont even hear me out for not disclosing to me that transmission cannot be checked if engine is not running, I asked . A responsible businessman should have disclosed to me this pertinent information,they knew i dont have a good funding , i even came down to look at a used car they were selling for $ 3200 and offered to call a junk yard for me and get $ 50 for our car .
    My fault was trusting them each time i go to them ( have been for years ) . From March 15 til March 22, i was sure I didn’t want the engine replaced. March 22, was the night (after work) when they had me convinced, my daughter and I were there to check the audi they were selling,but it was sold. So they came around saying “you just paid for the registration in January for your car , if you buy another used car, you will pay for smog and registration and even if we checked it, still no guarantee, if you replace the engine, it will run for 4-5 years with just minor repairs like brakes, tires, change the oil , all major repairs like transmission and timing belts are all fine “. This changed our minds. Someone here asked me why i asked for timing belts, clearly that explains that i dont know anything about cars. As a responsible business entity, they should have explained to me what you have said that once engine is replaced, timing belts get changed too and again , there is no way of checking the transmission unless the engine is running. I also wouldn’t let my daughter drive a car with a bad transmission, i did a research here and it all said, if not fixed,could lead to bigger problems and get stopped in the middle of the road in a bad traffic again, dangerous for her and other people.Certainly, i would not pay it then sell it without disclosing that the transmission is bad to a potential buyer.
     
  18. Zigner

    Zigner Well-Known Member

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    Let me ask you this: Before the engine died, was the car otherwise operating properly? If yes, then you may not even need a new/rebuilt transmission.
     
  19. Ichu

    Ichu Law Topic Starter New Member

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    Months before this problem, besides the AC not working, the check engine light came on and my daughter complained that the response is delayed when you switch gears especially when pressing the gas pedal ( i know , i drove it ) , so we took it to the same shop and their diagnosis was , the catalytic converter was bad . They said ,its okay to just drive it like that .
     
  20. mightymoose

    mightymoose Moderator

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    You chose the shop.
    It sounds like you chose a lesser quality shop to try and save some money.
    I understand your complaint as it is common. Ultimately the things you are unhappy about point back to you and your failure to obtain any additional cost estimates or inspections.
    You have good reason to be upset, but you have not provided anything that I have seen that indicates the shop did anything wrong.
     

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