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Grandmother vs Grandfather

Discussion in 'Guardians & Conservators' started by Yukon Gold, Mar 13, 2021.

  1. Yukon Gold

    Yukon Gold Law Topic Starter New Member

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    Jurisdiction:
    Oklahoma
    Any help will be greatly appreciated!
    My daughter has just completed rehab and is in sober living trying to rebuild her life. When she was deep into her addiction she handed her so over to her father and his new wife - October 2019. He has a health condition that requires 2 shots per day and numerous pills. It’s a complicated illness. The new wife is a nurse.
    My daughter signed over temporary guardianship so they could take him to his medical appointments etc. It has been a very difficult and emotional 18 months. I can not manage his medical issues or he would be with me. I was out of state when this handover happened. My grandson and I are extremely close. Prior to being handed over he barely knew these people because they were not actively involved in his life. I tried to do a co-guardianship so that I could secure visitation and make sure my grandson stayed close to his siblings. The stepmom refused to allow. My visitation with him has been frequent and somewhat flexible. Now - all these month later - when my daughter is preparing to get him back - the step mom hits the breaks on my visits. Only every other weekend. He just turned 4! No school. No reason to change what was working so well. I’m angry and I believe that the step mom may be putting things in place to contest the return. She tried to adopt 2 children a few years ago but ICWA laws prevented. I’m seeing my grandson as their substitute. She is very harsh - my grandsons siblings won’t even go visit because they dislike her - very militant. She is also a late night alcoholic.
    My question is what can I do to intervene? To secure my rights? Please help. Thank you
     
  2. justblue

    justblue Well-Known Member

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    Grandparents don't have innate legal rights to their grandchildren. You can visit during your daughters visitation time. It is unlikely your daughter will be getting primary custody of her son back unless the father does so voluntarily.
     
  3. Yukon Gold

    Yukon Gold Law Topic Starter New Member

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    Why do you say that?
     
  4. Yukon Gold

    Yukon Gold Law Topic Starter New Member

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    To be clear it is my ex/husband - my daughters father - he and his wife have temporary guardianship
     
  5. justblue

    justblue Well-Known Member

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    Child has been with his father for the last year and a half of his 4 years of life while your daughter was in rehab from a drug addiction. Don't get me wrong, I applaud your daughter for addressing her addiction, but her child should not have to upend his life and move away from his home because she is now ready to go back to being a mother. IMO it is unlikely a Judge would change custody.
     
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  6. Yukon Gold

    Yukon Gold Law Topic Starter New Member

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    It is the child’s grandfather
     
  7. justblue

    justblue Well-Known Member

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    Oh...I'm sorry! I misread your opening post. Was the guardianship as a result of a CPS investigation? Was it voluntary or court ordered?
     
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  8. Yukon Gold

    Yukon Gold Law Topic Starter New Member

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    My tag line is confusing. Apologies. Can’t change it. Should have said Grandmother vs Grandfather. First time poster
     
  9. Yukon Gold

    Yukon Gold Law Topic Starter New Member

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    It was voluntary. No DHS or CPS involvement
     
  10. zddoodah

    zddoodah Well-Known Member

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    I assume "so" in this sentence was supposed to be "son."

    To whom does "he" refer in this sentence? Your grandson or your daughter's father?

    What's the deal with the child's father?

    You mean your daughter's father's wife? She has no legal standing to "allow" or "refuse[] to allow" anything.

    All things considered, that's quite frequent for a grandparent.

    What rights? You don't have any rights to secure.

    If there was a court-ordered guardianship, then your daughter will have to apply to the court to terminate the guardianship. If this was all done informally, then she can re-take possession of her child at any time.

    You may, if you want, file a petition seeking visitation. I suggest you consult with a local attorney.
     
  11. Yukon Gold

    Yukon Gold Law Topic Starter New Member

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    It’s a temporary guardianship my daughter signed outside of court to HER father and his wife. They got an attorney and filed it with the court. My daughter did not appear. My grandsons father is not in the picture and never has been. I understand my rights as a grandparent in a custody situation or a court ordered guardianship. However, I’m not clear how it works in this voluntary, temporary guardianship.
    It seems to me as if my husbands new wife is planning on contesting my grandsons return to his mom. Why else would she all of a sudden put me on a visitation schedule? Can she do that? My grandson never wants to go back to their house. I don’t see that it’s in his best interest to change his time with me at this point.
     
  12. Zigner

    Zigner Well-Known Member

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    So it IS a court-ordered guardianship. That means that the court memorialized it as an order, upon request of the involved parties.
     
  13. Yukon Gold

    Yukon Gold Law Topic Starter New Member

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    So it’s no longer voluntary? The court decides if my grandson is returned? The guardian has full custody? Can she refuse to return him? I have no authority to intervene if it comes to that?
     
  14. justblue

    justblue Well-Known Member

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    How often did mom have visitation in the last year and a half?
     
  15. Yukon Gold

    Yukon Gold Law Topic Starter New Member

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    I won’t lie. My daughter was MIA. She was battling a bad drug addiction. She has been back since December and doing every she can to get her life back. She is a nurse. Has an excellent job. But it is a lot. Her visits were sporadic. This site is going to cut me off for 24 hours after this post. I’m limited to only 5 in a 24 hour period. So please give me your thoughts. ANY guidance would be much appreciated.
     
  16. Zigner

    Zigner Well-Known Member

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    Your daughter can go to court to have the guardianship reversed.

    Oklahoma legal aid has a page to give information for possible grandparent visitation for you. You will likely need an attorney if it is contested.

    Welcome to Legal Aid Services of Oklahoma's guide to free legal help in Oklahoma.
     
  17. justblue

    justblue Well-Known Member

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    How long has she been sober? Define "sporadic", please.

    ETA: Your daughter has been MIA for almost half her very young son's life. She will likely have to have supervised visitation and or Therapeutic Visitation (google the term). The child is likely very bonded, probably in a child/parent bond, with his grandfather and step-grandmother...if/when custody goes back to mom it is very likely that the judge will award liberal visitation to them. Which would be in the childs best interest in this situation.
     
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2021
    leslie82 likes this.
  18. zddoodah

    zddoodah Well-Known Member

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    Let's put it this way: There is no such thing as a non-court-ordered guardianship. Stated differently, only a guardianship ordered by a court is valid. You wrote that this was "signed outside the court," but then you wrote that it was "filed with the court," so it is a court-ordered guardianship. That it was "voluntary" (as opposed to having been done over your daughter's objection) isn't relevant.

    As I wrote previously, your ex-husband's new wife has no legal standing to do anything. However, you have no rights to visitation unless it has been ordered by the court.

    As I wrote previously: If there was a court-ordered guardianship, then your daughter will have to apply to the court to terminate the guardianship. If this was all done informally, then she can re-take possession of her child at any time. You may, if you want, file a petition seeking visitation.

    It's also worth pointing out that no one here has read the papers that were filed with the court, so we don't know what they do and don't allow for. Again, retaining legal counsel would be a smart thing to do.
     
  19. Zigner

    Zigner Well-Known Member

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    It's quite possible that the guardianship order grants them both guardianship, so it's quite possible that the ex-husband's new wife does have legal standing for various things regarding the child.
     
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  20. Yukon Gold

    Yukon Gold Law Topic Starter New Member

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    I lived with him for 2 years. Ive been here for him. Visitation probably 5 days or more every 2 weeks. Now all of a sudden she stopped that and said only overt other weekend
     

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