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An Afghanistan Thread

Discussion in 'General Chat, News, TV, Politics' started by PayrollHRGuy, Aug 17, 2021.

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  1. PayrollHRGuy

    PayrollHRGuy Law Topic Starter Well-Known Member

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  2. Redemptionman

    Redemptionman Active Member

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    Yeah, like we don't need more of this. The thing I do not understand the most is why those people who vote democrats (east/ west coast) continue to do that. They are going to be first to experience the repercussions of this when the next 9-11 comes. I think it will be even more devastating than the previous one. I guess they don't care though just as long as they keep the FREE stuff flowing for as long as they can. Which will unfortunately for them and us will come to an end sooner or later.
     
  3. army judge

    army judge Super Moderator

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    It was a bad idea from the very beginning to put US boots on the ground in Afghanistan.

    We can thank Lil Georgie Bush for that move.

    In fact, had Lil Georgie B been savvy enough, there would have been no US boots on the ground in Iraq or Afghanistan.

    Along comes Obama, and trades Taliban members for Bowe Berghdahl.

    Trump followed suit, but wasn't savvy enough either as he negotiated a bad deal, if press accounts can be believed. I also find it odd that very little of the substance of that deal has ever been made public.

    There is plenty of blame to apportion for this decaying carcass.

    Heck, one could even make the case that Daddy Bush got lucky by using some form of self restraint.

    He was criticized at the time for not doing more.

    That said, I've always said we were looking for bad actors in all the wrong places.

    The Saudis had their paws all over this odorous, putrefying skunk.

    Yet, no one but the Israelis ever look in the right places in the big sand box.

    President Pringle should have started evacuating embassy personnel when he made the withdrawal announcement two months ago. Heck, we could have started withdrawing federal employees and contractors in May.

    All I can say to today's veterans and active military personnel, is welcome to my nightmare, Nam.

    We fought valiantly during that conflict, too.

    Yet, our nation took an "L".

    As I've said for decades, those who fought in WWII can say they won a real war, not some localized squabble.

    As the days progress, perhaps more will be revealed, said, or done to enlighten the citizenry about the recent squabble in the sand box.
     
  4. Redemptionman

    Redemptionman Active Member

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    It is a sad state of affairs, but I really do not like when current Presidents blame previous Presidents for their mistakes. Own your decisions, one thing which Trump did well but the powers that be wanted him out so he was. Now the Afghans have a free open border pass to the USA.
     
  5. PayrollHRGuy

    PayrollHRGuy Law Topic Starter Well-Known Member

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    I disagree. We had to put boots on the ground there to root out AQ. Where the mistake was made from day one was not forcing Pakistan to allow us to move an armored division to block the Taliban & AQ from using Pakistan as a hideout and then push through the country from the North.
     
  6. Redemptionman

    Redemptionman Active Member

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  7. PayrollHRGuy

    PayrollHRGuy Law Topic Starter Well-Known Member

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    What bothers me the most is the huge intelligence failure that happened here. Afghanistan probably had more intelligence officers on the ground than any other country and they didn't see this was going to happen exactly as it happened?

    There are entire sections of the CIA that need to be fired.
     
  8. army judge

    army judge Super Moderator

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    Making a deal with the Pakis would have been useless.

    That said, I see no reason we should be in that part of the world, UNLESS it were to be assisting the Israelis on their soil.

    The Brits created that mess.

    There is no useful reason for us to swim in their polluted pool.

    Twenty years in that sandbox approximates .555 of our efforts in the following wars: seven years for the Revolutionary War, two years for War of 1812, Mexican War was two years, our Civil war was four years, WWI four years, WWII another four years, Korean War was three years, and Nam was ten years of direct involvement.

    We had nothing to gain in that sandbox, but we have sustained between 4400 to 4500 US troop deaths. Add in other casualties, as in injured/wounded/maimed, I suspect that exceeds 25,000.
     
  9. Redemptionman

    Redemptionman Active Member

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    CIA? you say

    this whole operation along with the problems going on internally in the USA is all a result of the CIA. Talk about an enemy of America, it is all a great big operation to bring about the grand finale.

    The collapse of the good ole USA, just don't know what they will create. I would imagine a huge territorial war lord crap zone just like the good ole Ukraine. I just wish Kennedy could have had his wish to shred and shatter all the FBI, CIA and Secret Service to the wind where they belong.
     
  10. army judge

    army judge Super Moderator

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    I agree.
    Heck, that agency has rarely earned it's keep unless it spying on US citizens!
    I spent 18 months of my four year tour in Nam, babysitting those creeps (often saving their snooty asses) throughout the jungles of southeast Asia.
     
  11. army judge

    army judge Super Moderator

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    Once one understands THAT, one understand WHO was behind the deaths of the Kennedy brothers, MLK, Malcolm X, and the attack on George Wallace.
     
  12. army judge

    army judge Super Moderator

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  13. PayrollHRGuy

    PayrollHRGuy Law Topic Starter Well-Known Member

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    And China will jump right in.
     
  14. PayrollHRGuy

    PayrollHRGuy Law Topic Starter Well-Known Member

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  15. Tax Counsel

    Tax Counsel Well-Known Member

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    Trump is the one who signed the agreement for the Afghan pull out. There is, as Army Judge noted, plenty of blame for this going back several presidents. This is not all just on Biden. Afghanistan has been a mess for decades — the Soviets found that out in the 1980s — and is likely to be a mess for decades to come. It's not a place we ever going to have huge success, IMO.
     
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  16. army judge

    army judge Super Moderator

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    If a person knew nothing else, other than the abject failure and cluster f*ck Afghanistan became for the THEN SOVIETS, that alone would dissuade any sane person from ever becoming involved in that part of the world.

    How four US Presidents were snookered on this deal is beyond my comprehension.
    Bush Jr. was, if nothing else, a savvy politician, surrounded by competent advisors (for the most part).

    Obama was younger, but adept at politics, and surrounded by a competent staff, too.
    Somehow the wunderkind was bamboozled into continuing the struggle in the sandbox. he even made a deal to release an army deserter in exchange for some high profile terrorists.

    Trump comes along, and he's no politician. He's a populist, yet he got ensnared in a deal to end the conflict. We all see how that is working today. Trump had an instinct for trading, wheeling, and dealing.

    Yet, the deal which Biden is addressing, very little is known about what exactly was arranged. Biden comes along, he is a 50 year politician, and he even got taken in by the sandbox people.

    Twenty years, thousands of lives impacted, and no one has anything to show for those 20 years, nothing that is but tears, blood, sweat, and pain.

    The sad thing is with 9/11's 20th anniversary looming, so to is the thought of some sort of terrorist action. The southern border has been wide open for months. No one knows how many terrorists entered undetected.

    No one knows what MIGHT happen on 9/11 this year. One of the Taliban spokesmen said today, "no American will be harmed in Afghanistan". I thought that to be an odd turn of a phrase. What with our open border, I'm sticking close to home in the first two weeks of September.

    I have a friend who is a retired station chief for the CIA. He said there is a lot of unusual communications from that part of the world. He said stay alert.
     
  17. army judge

    army judge Super Moderator

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    Taliban replacing old AKs with new US weaponry: M4 & M16

    On a personal note, I carried an M4 Carbine in Nam for 4 years, along with a standard sidearm M1911. 45 ACP.

    My dad carried an M4 during in WWII.

    It saddened me to see the "peaceful" Taliban thugs sporting US made weaponry.

    We can thank the Afghan "army", the best trained, best armed, ready to fight, nothing to worry about, (said President Pringle) army to keep Afghanistan secure from any Taliban takeover. :rolleyes:


    As Taliban takes over, some swap iconic AK-47s for made-in-America rifles
     
    Last edited: Aug 17, 2021
  18. Redemptionman

    Redemptionman Active Member

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    What message does this send to the American troops who got injured over there and/ or lost their lives?

    Biden is weak and has no plan that is obvious, but I promise you this never would have ever happened under Trump. He would have take care of it.
     
  19. army judge

    army judge Super Moderator

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    The same message I received as a young buck in and after Nam.

    Our nation hasn't won a war in 76 years.

    It seems we've grown accustomed to losing.
    Its about the will to fight for something you wish to protect.

    What we're observing is a professional military that sees themselves as employees, not as soldiers.

    They'll get over it.

    I sure as heck did.
     
  20. Tax Counsel

    Tax Counsel Well-Known Member

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    I don't think so. Trump may have handled it differently if he were still in office, but not likely any better. Trump was not ever one that was particularly good at military matters. That was not one of his strong points.
     

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