Quick help

[trit0n]

Jurisdiction

California

Judge orders noncustodial parent to visit our child for Memorial day weekend. No set day or time, so assuming since the judge said weekend, it starts Saturday, as he is leaving it up to us to come to a compromise.
However the father refused to try and make any agreement, and simply told me "I'll be there to pick up (child's name) at (time) on Friday for my memorial day weekend."

I told him that there is no set time or day, so Saturday at (any time that works for him) will be the best. He refused to, and continued to demand me and send me long messages, threatening the cops, etc.

I ignored, and I told him to please follow court's orders (lawyer advised that it starts on a Saturday so I followed my lawyer's advice). I kept it very simple and followed court orders as is. I do not give in to his threatening messages that he keeps sending me on our court ordered website for our communication.

He ended up coming over on Friday, and I told him in person, "You can come back tomorrow as it is not your day with our child per court orders, and you refused to make any agreement with me." He proceed to scream at me in the front of the child and threatened to call the cops. I said go ahead, but cops never showed up and he left appx 30 minutes later and send me a message saying he's going to file a police report just for that. I ignored again.

Then he used this as a message saying I'm the one that screamed, and I'm the one that called the cops... etc etc. Same usual messages he would send. I still ignored them, as it is not a part of court orders or has anything to do with our child's visitation with him.

Keep in mind that his regular visitation is from Sunday (time) to Monday (time). (Along with other court ordered visitation days but I will not list them as they are not related to this issue at the moment). He end up picking up our child on Saturday at the given time, for his court ordered Memorial Day weekend, which was fine with me.

Now, he is threatening me (on the website) that he is going to keep our child until Tuesday, as he says it is Memorial day weekend, when Tuesday is a weekday and the court orders only states he has the child until Monday at (time). He also states that it is a part of the government time that considers Tuesday a weekend in part of Memorial day as well.... He expects me to be in compliance for whatever he demands me to do something. So, my question is, what happens if he does this? Since it is against the court orders, would he be found in contempt of court to have kept our child outside of court orders without any mutual agreement that he refused to have with me? What is my next step?

Thank you in advance

 

[adjusterjack]

Since it is against the court orders, would he be found in contempt of court to have kept our child outside of court orders without any mutual agreement that he refused to have with me?

As a practical matter, if your child wasn't home Monday evening and you filed for contempt on Tuesday, it wouldn't get into court for who knows how long and I suspect that the judge would just tell your ex not to do it again.

Again, as a practical matter, would it have killed you to let the child go on Friday for the weekend instead of exposing your child to this ridiculous hostility that obviously exists between you and your ex?

I keep reading these disgusting exhibitions of hostility between exes who want to crucify each other for the slightest little thing. You know who suffers for all that? The child.

Try this. Call your ex and tell him it's OK for him to bring the child home Tuesday morning and to have a nice holiday. He won't know what hit him and maybe you'll get along better in the future when other compromises have to be made.

Be the better person and bend first.

 

[trit0n]

I've bend over many times for him. I have allowed him to go a day early, have earlier times, be late sometimes, etc. This constant behaving from him existed for a long time, when I have been more than fine to do anything, to the point where I had enough of being talked down to after attempting to reconcile my parental relationship with him for our child.

I took co-parenting class as ordered by the court, while he refused to. I made attempts to establish a cooperative relationship with him to better the situation for our child and to compromise better and he refused. We made an agreement outside the court orders in writing, and he end up not following it or stick to the compromise to the agreement we made. I do not want our child to go through this, which is why I did the above. His father has constantly tried to hold our child against me just because of our issues, when I have been more than nice enough to do what is the best for our child. He's told me many times that I'll be getting a court date in the mail, and it never happens.

So as a result, the lawyer advised me to be firm with the court orders as she said, "he expects you to be in compliance with his demands and since you're finally pushing back, he does not know how to handle it. Stick to every step on the court orders". Which is why I asked what is the next step if he does not bring our child back home per court orders.

As a practical matter, if your child wasn't home Monday evening and you filed for contempt on Tuesday, it wouldn't get into court for who knows how long and I suspect that the judge would just tell your ex not to do it again.

Again, as a practical matter, would it have killed you to let the child go on Friday for the weekend instead of exposing your child to this ridiculous hostility that obviously exists between you and your ex?

I keep reading these disgusting exhibitions of hostility between exes who want to crucify each other for the slightest little thing. You know who suffers for all that? The child.

Try this. Call your ex and tell him it's OK for him to bring the child home Tuesday morning and to have a nice holiday. He won't know what hit him and maybe you'll get along better in the future when other compromises have to be made.

Be the better person and bend first.

 

[army judge]

The next step, if you wish to disregard Jack's advice, is to go to court.
However, with one apparent violation, some judges become annoyed with both parties.
Your judge seems of that ilk, because he instructed you both to compromise and settle it.

Most people document negative behaviors and only return to court when they've compiled a bundle of charges.

Ask your attorney, ask your trusted family and friends, see what others say.

Frankly, I feel your frustrations.

But, I'd try more kindness.
Besides, parents take any blow for their children, it's what we do to improve their little lives.

 

[shrinkmaster]

Judges strongly dislike it when parents cannot act like adults for sake of children and request court to solve petty matters. I am not downplaying your issue. However its in everyone's best interest (especially child or children) that the two parents work it out. Its called "Co-parenting". If you do take this to court be prepared for neither party to win. Often times the court ruling will displease both sides. the Judge could even scold you in court and tell you to work it out like adults. Make sure you have made every effort to resolve your issues with other parent before asking court to do so. Document your efforts. Co-Parenting Advice For Your Children | Parent Nook

In my signature line is a forum (Parenting forum) hosted by this site. There you may find other parents who have had similar issues and find out how the dealt with their issues.

 

[trit0n]

Thank you everyone. I talked with the father today, with even more kindness.

Told him he can have him until Tuesday up until the start of his program (academy) time if thats what he wish, but I would to have a more open line of communication and compromise that I have been trying to have with him to better our relationship for our son.

The father snapped back and said this, "I do not need to do what we (court orders) have to do I'll keep my son for as long I want, and he's not going to school since he'll be missing out on the time with me."

(I have full custody, while he has visitation rights. School are set days and time 3x a week and Tuesdays is one of them.)

 

[trit0n]

Thank you, I will be trying out that forum.

Judges strongly dislike it when parents cannot act like adults for sake of children and request court to solve petty matters. I am not downplaying your issue. However its in everyone's best interest (especially child or children) that the two parents work it out. Its called "Co-parenting". If you do take this to court be prepared for neither party to win. Often times the court ruling will displease both sides. the Judge could even scold you in court and tell you to work it out like adults. Make sure you have made every effort to resolve your issues with other parent before asking court to do so. Document your efforts. Co-Parenting Advice For Your Children | Parent Nook

In my signature line is a forum (Parenting forum) hosted by this site. There you may find other parents who have had similar issues and find out how the dealt with their issues.

 

[adjusterjack]

The father snapped back and said this, "I do not need to do what we (court orders) have to do I'll keep my son for as long I want, and he's not going to school since he'll be missing out on the time with me."

After reading that I'm moving back to your side.

Too bad CA is an "all party" consent state for the recording of phone conversation.

If you don't get your son back Tuesday morning, call the police.

It's a crime under the CA Penal Code:

CA Codes (pen:277-280)

Don't threaten him with it, just do it. It's time you started playing hard ball.

 

[trit0n]

I've dealt with this kind of behavior from him majority of our son's life. He acts the same way about his medical appointments, sporting activities, and especially school.

Just... Frustrating. I try to hold it back for my son.


I contacted my local police station (we live in different counties, he only lives Less than an hour away in another county). They suggested I go to the fathers house but a block away and call their police to come to me, and go and get my child. They told me to call the other county, so I did. They suggest that there's nothing they can do, and cannot enforce the father to give me the child, but can write out a police report for violation of court orders.

I have not contacted the father after the conversation I had with him (on court ordered website) this morning that I posted about in my previous post.

Thank you, Jack, for that information.

After reading that I'm moving back to your side.

Too bad CA is an "all party" consent state for the recording of phone conversation.

If you don't get your son back Tuesday morning, call the police.

It's a crime under the CA Penal Code:

CA Codes (pen:277-280)

Don't threaten him with it, just do it. It's time you started playing hard ball.

 

[adjusterjack]

They suggest that there's nothing they can do, and cannot enforce the father to give me the child, but can write out a police report for violation of court orders.

Because they are lazy. Remind them that it's a crime. Then go pick up your child. Bring a witness. If your ex gives you grief, call the police on the spot and report that he has kidnapped your child and you are afraid he will do harm to you and the child. That ought to get them off their butts.

 

[trit0n]

Because they are lazy. Remind them that it's a crime. Then go pick up your child. Bring a witness. If your ex gives you grief, call the police on the spot and report that he has kidnapped your child and you are afraid he will do harm to you and the child. That ought to get them off their butts.

I will do that. Thank you.

 

[trit0n]

Update: Father still refused to have our son home in time for his academy. He demanded that I pick him up as he does not 'have' to return him home and that it is my responsibility to pick him up earlier than the time he gave me (court orders father is responsible for all transportation). As a result I notified the police as suggested, and I was able to have him home few hours later. I do have a police report. They didn't end up charging him as he was cooperating with the police after he tried to make excuses for not to bring our son home.

Few hours later, he demanded I have a doctor's note (I don't know why...) just because his visitation is over and our son needed to be home in time for academy. So he wants a doctor's note for that. I told him I don't need to provide any documentation per court orders, except to share what happened at each visit, and that he knows our son needs to be home in time for academy and his holiday weekend visitation was over at midnight. No idea why he would want to mention the doctor's.

 

[adjusterjack]

I suggest you ignore his BS for a while and if he does this again next visit, call the police again. Maybe next time they will arrest him and sooner or later he'll get the idea (hopefully) unless he's just a lunatic.

If he doesn't get the idea, eventually you will have to take him back to court and have a judge slap him around a bit.

 

[army judge]

There is no easy solution for a difficult problem.
All you does continue to be a great parent.
You can document each action the father is alleged to commit (good and bad), if you ever return to court you'll have information the court might wish to see.

 

[trit0n]

Funny you say that, he also complained about how I ignore most of his messages (ones that I am not obligated to respond to- as it is mostly looking for things to argue about) Then he said it's because I have feelings for him and I can't put it aside to co parent.

I plan on taking him to mediation when our son starts grade school (he gets no visitation while son is in school except for select holidays so I want to set it to every other weekend) that way if things didn't work out in mediation and he still wants to interfere with his education, then we will be seeing the judge.

I suggest you ignore his BS for a while and if he does this again next visit, call the police again. Maybe next time they will arrest him and sooner or later he'll get the idea (hopefully) unless he's just a lunatic.

If he doesn't get the idea, eventually you will have to take him back to court and have a judge slap him around a bit.

 

[trit0n]

There is no easy solution for a difficult problem.
All you does continue to be a great parent.
You can document each action the father is alleged to commit (good and bad), if you ever return to court you'll have information the court might wish to see.

I will have all documents handy. Latest is when I had to cancel his day visitation for our son's medical appointment (court orders state I do not need to consult with him and I have the major decision). I offered him make up times twice and he rejected both of them because he feels like the doctors is taking away his time and that it's not important. He said he does not approve of it unless I provide proper documentation.
I told him to follow court orders, as I do not need to consult with him aside from letting him know and share what happens at the visit. He continues to say he disapprove and rejected both make up times offering.
Documented that so the judge can see he does not put our son's health as a priority.