Alcohol & Drugs: DUI, DWI Pc 422

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gborges

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california
the 5 elements of pc 422 for conviction.. if theres 4 'victims' does the 5 elements need to be satisfied for each person? 4 kids at 930-1000 pm walking by took off running, saying that i had a shotgun pointed at them..

one of the kids is a son of a police officer.. police showed up about 1 hour later and ordered me out of the house. i refused.. no warrants.. they requested to search my garage because obviously the kids said i had a gun in there.. i consented..

i walked into the garage and was handcuffed.. they searched the garage.. no weapon.. i was still hauled off "well we still have enough probable cause anyhow" of of the 3 cops said.

my main question is elements and how they work with multiple 'victims', and how many of you legal gurus have ever heard of pc 422 charged with more than one victim? isnt it kind of hard to make 4 people all at once think your going to kill them? i would think even if one didnt think so, then it stands to argue the others that did have fear are overreacting.. as far as i know, the cops son (all of them 14 years old) ran home which is 5 houses down from me and told his father..

if i pointed a gun at them like they said, they dont have a gun in the garage, and im not charged with any brandishing. if they were hellbent on seizing a gun?

this is a town of 5000 and the cops here barely classify as policeman, but that doesnt change the fact my name is gonna get drug in the mud...

(i have no criminal record, had a DUI in 1999 that i beat with a dmv hearing, and yes, one of the cops this night is one of the cops that arrested me back then)

any advice than the obvious would be appreciated.. i know i need council. a top lawyer in the area laughed and said get a PD dont bother wasting money, but thats easy for him to say....

thank you!
 
if theres 4 'victims' does the 5 elements need to be satisfied for each person? 4 kids at 930-1000 pm walking by took off running, saying that i had a shotgun pointed at them..
Why wouldn't that apply to all of them? You can be convicted of one count of the offense for each victim or occurrence ... if you were so charged.

one of the kids is a son of a police officer.
Bad choice of victims on your part.

i walked into the garage and was handcuffed.. they searched the garage.. no weapon.. i was still hauled off "well we still have enough probable cause anyhow" of of the 3 cops said.
The statements of the victims can be sufficient to meet the probable cause necessary to make an arrest for a felony.

isnt it kind of hard to make 4 people all at once think your going to kill them?
No. I've seen this charged many times - usually in gang crimes.

Were you also charged with PC 417 or 245?

would think even if one didnt think so, then it stands to argue the others that did have fear are overreacting.
And you'd be wrong. Since the perception is that of the person at the receiving end, the most you'd have would be the dropping of one count.

But, your attorney is free to make whatever argument he thinks will prevail.

if i pointed a gun at them like they said, they dont have a gun in the garage, and im not charged with any brandishing. if they were hellbent on seizing a gun?
Without a gun their case is weakened, but by no means gone. And the charges you have been arrested for are not necessarily the charges you will face at trial. The DA could very well tack on additional offenses ... or, if the pieces don't fit very well, they may drop the matter entirely.

this is a town of 5000 and the cops here barely classify as policeman, but that doesnt change the fact my name is gonna get drug in the mud...
Well ... DID you point a gun at them? If so, who do you think is responsible for your name being dragged through the mud??

(i have no criminal record, had a DUI in 1999 that i beat with a dmv hearing, and yes, one of the cops this night is one of the cops that arrested me back then)
A DMV hearing doesn't win a DUI. They are separate issues. If you prevailed in the DUI matter, good for you. Hopefully you learned from that incident that drinking and driving do not mix.

any advice than the obvious would be appreciated.. i know i need council. a top lawyer in the area laughed and said get a PD dont bother wasting money, but thats easy for him to say....
If you qualify for a PD then you probably cannot readily afford private counsel anyway. This case may well hinge solely on the credibility of the complaining parties. If their credibility is weak, then the DA may choose not to file. If they are good kids with a solid rep., then you may be in trouble.

Do you have a good reason for pointing the gun at them? What were they doing? Did you say anything when you pointed it at them? All of these are going to be issues for your defense ... or things the prosecution will address ... so you may want to consider them.

- Carl
 
Well ... DID you point a gun at them? If so, who do you think is responsible for your name being dragged through the mud??

no i did not point a gun at anyone.. i realize i cant give my whole life story but i am 45, run a farm business after working as an EMT for 12 years.. i have an elderly mom who i am responsible for, im an only child. i have property, small nut harvesting business, house paid for, and never left my house when all these allegations surfaced last saturday.. my view is one of the kids thought he saw a weapon while i was unloading my supplies for my machines as i do every evening when i come home.


Do you have a good reason for pointing the gun at them? What were they doing? Did you say anything when you pointed it at them?

once again, nothing was pointed at four kids walking down the street in the dark at 10pm give or take a minute.. i didnt even know what the police were at the front door for.. i was just told recently by a friends kid that the officers son is the one who told his dad i pointed a gun at them. the kid openly commented at the high school..

kids are notorious for lying and exaggerating, i did so myself as a teen, and so did the rest of us.. im not saying the kids werent afraid of something.

ignorance breeds fear.. we all were scared of the bOOgie man at one time as kids also.

im not trying to argue. im scared to death of all this. im just trying to make heads or tails of all this..

i know were all "innocent and falsely accused"... my dad woulda whooped my butt if i ran home accusing an adult of anything. if i pissed someone off at that age my dad woulda said you probably deserved it, and for the most part he was correct.. the cop in question knows me well. it really is a nightmare..

thank you for the input earlier its appreciated..
 
i have property, small nut harvesting business, house paid for, and never left my house when all these allegations surfaced last saturday.. my view is one of the kids thought he saw a weapon while i was unloading my supplies for my machines as i do every evening when i come home.
It seems very odd that they would charge for 422 if you were a distance away and note even saying anything to them.

kids are notorious for lying and exaggerating, i did so myself as a teen, and so did the rest of us.. im not saying the kids werent afraid of something.
That's a broad generality that really won't get very far. Unless the defense can get the kids to admit that, "Maybe it wasn't a gun ..." things may not look so good. I suspect they have something more than just your movements unloading stuff from a truck. And what motive would the kids have to make this up?

the cop in question knows me well. it really is a nightmare..
It's always going to be a nightmare. But I have to think that there was some other action or statement on your part that gave the impression - even if false - that you committed the acts. If it IS this weak, then I suspect the DA will drop the matter.

- Carl
 
Ah, small towns with small town justice. ..

I think the standard is usually that of the "average ordinary person." I'm curious why it took an hour, as if someone aimed a shotgun at me, and I feared for my life, the moment I'd have access to a phone is the moment I'd call the police. And I would expect that the police would react as quickly as possible upon hearing about some nut with a shotgun.
 
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Ah, small towns with small town justice. ..
It also makes it easier to sort out the wheat from the chaffe. We tend to know the players much better in a smaller town. I used to work in a big city, and a big county before that, and now a small town and county ... much more rewarding, and much easier to solve some of the crimes.

I think the standard is usually that of the "average ordinary person." I'm curious why it took an hour, as if someone aimed a shotgun at me, and I feared for my life, the moment I'd have access to a phone is the moment I'd call the police. And I would expect that the police would react as quickly as possible upon hearing about some nut with a shotgun.
A small town ... it probably took them time to get the officers together and come up with a plan of how to possibly address the situation involving a potentially armed suspect, etc. Unlike TV there are not cops on every corner in smaller communities, adn they rarely go charging in.

At that time of night if things were average they might have two cops on ... they probably had to borrow from the sheriff's department or the CHP and that might take a while. Then they have to decide how to approach the situation and a supervisor of the Chief might have to be appraised in the middle of the night to offer his or her two cents' worth.

Sine the immediate threat was over with, the response could be measured and thought out - it did not have to be rushed. So, I am not at all surprised that an hour might have passed from the time of incident to the officers' response.

- Carl
 
And what motive would the kids have to make this up?

you mean the cops kid?
its too complicated and you would not believe it.
see around here, the cops dont like it when you actually dont incriminate yourself.. makes their jobs too hard..


'intent to terrorize' from my own garage..
ill be darned its a cops kid.

nothing fishy there..


a year ago my neighbor called the cops stating i said im gonna 'burn her house down'. the same cop said to me 'just deny everything'<=

a friends kid was actually shot at by a goofball in the country 1 month ago..
4 city cops, 3 sheriffs, and a CHP; they took his gun and said 'no no bad homeowner' and that was it..

sounds like a bunch of bullpOOp from me doesnt it? i didnt want to get into all this other stuff, i merely was asking a few things about pc 422.

once again thanks for the help. i wont bother you guys anymore on the matter
 
ah some people do understand small town mentality.. i could tell you guys many a story..

i think it was about an hour. i was in the house watching a movie when i heard cops yelling at me to come outside.. i told them to go get the warrant that way we can all say a judge granted it.. then they asked me if they could search my garage, and like an idiot i said go for it.. as soon as i walked into the garage from the house they pouned on me and handcuffed me.. searched the garage, found no weapons.. then said 'well we have enough evidence already'.

fact: i do have a shotgun.. its in the house. so does everyone else in this town. i hunt quail now and then..

thanks
 
you mean the cops kid?
its too complicated and you would not believe it.
see around here, the cops dont like it when you actually dont incriminate yourself.. makes their jobs too hard..
Not incriminating yourself doesn't mean you did not do what you were accused of. Very often the cops know who did what, they just can't prove it.

But, again, why would the KIDS have made things up? Or, are you going to assert that the cops sent the kids over and suggested they make up a story saying you pointed a shotgun at them? How long do you think it would take before one of those four would crack about THAT tale?

a year ago my neighbor called the cops stating i said im gonna 'burn her house down'. the same cop said to me 'just deny everything'
How very nice of him. But, when it comes down to cases of one person's word against another, very often that is what happens.

This time there are four witnesses.
a friends kid was actually shot at by a goofball in the country 1 month ago..
4 city cops, 3 sheriffs, and a CHP; they took his gun and said 'no no bad homeowner' and that was it..
It depends on the offense and what can be shown. Besides, the COPS do no decide what charges get pursued - the DA does. If the DA chose not to pursue the matter, it was not the cops who blew it off.

sounds like a bunch of bullpOOp from me doesnt it? i didnt want to get into all this other stuff, i merely was asking a few things about pc 422.
I have no idea what to believe. And no "bother".

If no words were spoken or written, then 422 will be nearly impossible to prove the elements of the offense. If it DOES get charged, I suspect it will be changed to PC 417 for brandishing a firearm.

- Carl
 
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